The Lebanon Thread

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Hans Bulvai
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Hans Bulvai »

The ordinary victims lost in the noise of Beirut's latest big story

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/com ... 21984.html
They found a part of a hand in rue Ibrahim el-Mounzer today, along with some intestines – no one doubted ownership of the thumb that was discovered, still pressing the button of a mobile phone. But the little people of Lebanon remained forgotten, the bereaved and the wounded, all 38 of them, largely not photographed.

Gun battles enshrined the streets of central Beirut a day after the nation buried Brigadier-General Wissam al-Hassan. But the bravest man in Lebanon yesterday stood in a church in the tired suburb of Bourj Hammoud: a young Armenian whose equally young wife was slaughtered last Friday.

I suppose we scribes always go for the Big Story – the Lebanese intelligence boss blown to bits in the Syria-style bomb assassination. The clichés are essential, as is the assumption that Syria's war is "slipping across the border", but the tragedy of Georgette Sarkissian should be told.

She was a victim whose life was every bit as precious as that of the man who was buried with such pomp and violence in central Beirut at the weekend. And if serving coffee and apples to bank employees in a narrow east Beirut street was less romantic than that of the Lebanese secret policeman so efficiently liquidated last week, her family story is worthy of a book rather than a newspaper article.

The General and Georgette died, of course, in the same millisecond.

Joseph Sarkissian's family came from the Mount of Olives in Palestine and his grandparents were thrown out of Armenia during the 1915 Turkish genocide. He stood next to his 21-year old daughter Therese – who was with her mother when she was killed, and wore a blood-red mascara of spotted wounds on her face that contrasted tragically with her black dress – shaking hands as one must at these awful "condolences", and spoke with such eloquence of his sorrow. In Lebanon, the big men get the imperial funerals, the little women are left to be buried.

But the biggest man in Lebanon was Joseph Sarkissian, an insurance official, short dark hair, spectacles, no tears in his eyes. In his own words, then, in perfect, flawless English: "I can't tell you… She is half my life. My daughter picked her up from the ground – she carried her in her arms because there were no ambulances, and drove her to the hospital in her own car.

"From the first, my wife was in a coma, thanks to God – because her head was opened from behind by the explosion. Part of her brain was missing. She is a treasure to me. You can't imagine… There were so many flowers for her and for me – because everyone loves her and everyone loves me.

"In Lebanon, there are too many surprises – every day, there is a new surprise. She was going to buy new shoes the same day. Today was the first day of her vacation. She wanted to rest this week – and now she rests forever."

Today was a day for such words. There was the local bank manager in rue Mohamed el-Mounzer who said Lebanon had endured "40 years of crucifixion" and that during the country's 1975-1990 civil war, "not a pane of glass had been broken in the street". There was the old man – like most of the others, a Christian – who uttered a quote-of-the-year in reference to General Hassan. "He was very low profile – everyone knew him," he said. Too true. General Hassan, a Muslim, thought he had a "safe house" in the street. But there are no "safe houses" in Lebanon, and – being a tiny little country – no "secret" policemen.

At the end of the road, I came across Lebanese ceramist Nathalie Khayat, bandages still covering the wounds to her back, who had been talking to her sons Noa and Teo when the bomb shredded Georgette's life – and those of the general and two of his men – and almost killed her. "The first thing I thought of was the civil war," she said. "I was looking at my son's homework. He is nine today. And I was nine when the civil war started in 1975."

The radios were talking of a gun and grenade battle between supporters of the 14 March alliance – the official opposition to the pro-Syrian government – and the Lebanese army which had come under fire from them during the night. And Abed, my driver, and I drove as we have so often these past decades to park near the museum, and I ran down the side street and stood next to the soldiers. And here comes your reporter, clumping into his own story again. On this very spot, beside this very road, next to this very wall, I took cover from bullets 36 years ago.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Jnalum Persicum »

.


. . not a single Syrian was ever charged by the international UN-backed tribunal that investigated Hariri’s death. And last week there was no evidence that Syria was implicated in Hassan’s assassination either.

.

The three main western backers of the Syrian and Lebanese opposition have shown their limits: It is perfectly okay to sow sectarian strife in Lebanon, Syria and elsewhere, but not if it means destabilization on several of Israel’s borders. One conflict-struck country is manageable in the Levant, but more than that and things can spread like wildfire. Controlled chaos is fine, but certainly not concurrent with a power vacuum. A powerless Lebanese state will mean loss of control over the critical southern territories along the Israeli border and along the eastern border with Syria – both are hard limits for FUKUS.

.


.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by monster_gardener »

Hans Bulvai wrote:The ordinary victims lost in the noise of Beirut's latest big story

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/com ... 21984.html
They found a part of a hand in rue Ibrahim el-Mounzer today, along with some intestines – no one doubted ownership of the thumb that was discovered, still pressing the button of a mobile phone. But the little people of Lebanon remained forgotten, the bereaved and the wounded, all 38 of them, largely not photographed.

Gun battles enshrined the streets of central Beirut a day after the nation buried Brigadier-General Wissam al-Hassan. But the bravest man in Lebanon yesterday stood in a church in the tired suburb of Bourj Hammoud: a young Armenian whose equally young wife was slaughtered last Friday.

I suppose we scribes always go for the Big Story – the Lebanese intelligence boss blown to bits in the Syria-style bomb assassination. The clichés are essential, as is the assumption that Syria's war is "slipping across the border", but the tragedy of Georgette Sarkissian should be told.

She was a victim whose life was every bit as precious as that of the man who was buried with such pomp and violence in central Beirut at the weekend. And if serving coffee and apples to bank employees in a narrow east Beirut street was less romantic than that of the Lebanese secret policeman so efficiently liquidated last week, her family story is worthy of a book rather than a newspaper article.

The General and Georgette died, of course, in the same millisecond.

Joseph Sarkissian's family came from the Mount of Olives in Palestine and his grandparents were thrown out of Armenia during the 1915 Turkish genocide. He stood next to his 21-year old daughter Therese – who was with her mother when she was killed, and wore a blood-red mascara of spotted wounds on her face that contrasted tragically with her black dress – shaking hands as one must at these awful "condolences", and spoke with such eloquence of his sorrow. In Lebanon, the big men get the imperial funerals, the little women are left to be buried.

But the biggest man in Lebanon was Joseph Sarkissian, an insurance official, short dark hair, spectacles, no tears in his eyes. In his own words, then, in perfect, flawless English: "I can't tell you… She is half my life. My daughter picked her up from the ground – she carried her in her arms because there were no ambulances, and drove her to the hospital in her own car.

"From the first, my wife was in a coma, thanks to God – because her head was opened from behind by the explosion. Part of her brain was missing. She is a treasure to me. You can't imagine… There were so many flowers for her and for me – because everyone loves her and everyone loves me.

"In Lebanon, there are too many surprises – every day, there is a new surprise. She was going to buy new shoes the same day. Today was the first day of her vacation. She wanted to rest this week – and now she rests forever."

Today was a day for such words. There was the local bank manager in rue Mohamed el-Mounzer who said Lebanon had endured "40 years of crucifixion" and that during the country's 1975-1990 civil war, "not a pane of glass had been broken in the street". There was the old man – like most of the others, a Christian – who uttered a quote-of-the-year in reference to General Hassan. "He was very low profile – everyone knew him," he said. Too true. General Hassan, a Muslim, thought he had a "safe house" in the street. But there are no "safe houses" in Lebanon, and – being a tiny little country – no "secret" policemen.

At the end of the road, I came across Lebanese ceramist Nathalie Khayat, bandages still covering the wounds to her back, who had been talking to her sons Noa and Teo when the bomb shredded Georgette's life – and those of the general and two of his men – and almost killed her. "The first thing I thought of was the civil war," she said. "I was looking at my son's homework. He is nine today. And I was nine when the civil war started in 1975."

The radios were talking of a gun and grenade battle between supporters of the 14 March alliance – the official opposition to the pro-Syrian government – and the Lebanese army which had come under fire from them during the night. And Abed, my driver, and I drove as we have so often these past decades to park near the museum, and I ran down the side street and stood next to the soldiers. And here comes your reporter, clumping into his own story again. On this very spot, beside this very road, next to this very wall, I took cover from bullets 36 years ago.
Thank you VERY Much for your post, Hans.

Very Sad Story.......... Reminds me of Lebanese friends of the family long ago.........

And the local Syrian haberdasher..........

Not sure there is going to be a good societal solution...... especially for Syria........

Have called the White House about this matter but I don't live in a battleground State so I expect that Obama cares not that much about what I think..........

Best advice I have........ Plan E for Evacuation........ Get out of there if you can and try to leave the old stuff behind if it promotes conflict.........

Need to take that advice here too....... Even here in Uz....... We too are at risk......... Need to get off planet...... Or at least Down Under.....
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Hans Bulvai »

monster_gardener wrote:
Need to take that advice here too....... Even here in Uz....... We too are at risk......... Need to get off planet...... Or at least Down Under.....
Worried about something in particular?
I read that ammo sales have quadrupled in the last few weeks.
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On the Slopes of Pompeii

Post by monster_gardener »

Hans Bulvai wrote:
monster_gardener wrote:
Need to take that advice here too....... Even here in Uz....... We too are at risk......... Need to get off planet...... Or at least Down Under.....
Worried about something in particular?
I read that ammo sales have quadrupled in the last few weeks.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Hans....

Mostly just the usual........ the pending Nuke war that has been around since I was in Elemental ;) School except for about 10 years from the fall of the Soviet Union till September 11, 2011...... :) Still remember the relaxation......

Remembering a Robert Heinlein short story.......IIRC it was titled "On the Slopes of Pompeii"........ A big city bar owner listens to his customers worry about a pending nuclear crisis...... One of them is a college professor who says he wants get to some place more rural and less of a target but is waiting till he can find an job opening at a "Cow College".......... The bar tender listens to the news on the radio/TV....... Decides the Prof is right..... He puts down his towel, grabs his jacket & wallet, leaves the bar to be operated by one of his employees and gets on the train for as rural a destination as he can find.... He gets off at a rural stop and begins to wonder if he has just panicked.... Calls the bar..... His employee answers somewhat annoyed that the boss has left all the work to him but suddenly there is the flash of a nuclear explosion behind the bar owner and the phone call is cut off........ The bar owner acted and survived while the college prof knew what to do but delayed to his death.......


As far as Ammo sales go...... That is an Obama/Eric Holder fear..... Fear of what Obama and Atty General Eric Holder will do if they do not have to worry about elections and have the"flexibility" to do what they want to do.....
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Hans Bulvai »

http://dailystar.com.lb/News/Politics/2 ... z2EFX5rqWU
TRIPOLI, Lebanon: Fierce fighting between supporters and opponents of Syrian President Bashar Assad rattled the northern city of Tripoli for a third day Wednesday, as the death toll rose to six people.

Syrian Ambassador Ali Abdel-Karim Ali told Foreign Minister Adnan Mansour that his country would hand over the bodies of Lebanese Salafists killed in the war-torn country last week – the ambush of the men in the town of Tal Kalakh by the Syrian army sparked the new round of clashes in Tripoli.

After intense fighting overnight Tuesday, sporadic clashes continued into the day between the neighborhoods of Jabal Mohsen, which supports Assad, and Bab al-Tabbaneh, where residents oppose the embattled Syrian leader. Fierce fighting resumed in the evening.

Residents of the two neighborhoods said they were being attacked and were defending themselves.

Walid Zoubi, a resident of Bab al-Tabbaneh, said the residents would defend themselves with whatever means available.

“The Free Syrian Army fought with stones in the early days [of the Syrian uprising], we will continue [to defend our neighborhood] despite the shortage in weapons,” he said.

Abdel-Latif Saleh, the media official of the Arab Democratic Party, which is influential in Jabal Mohsen, said that his group had been obeying the Army’s instructions.

“But things spun out of control and we were forced to respond after the heavy gunfire and rocket-propelled grenades that hit us,” he said.

Sheikh Malek Shaar, the Mufti of Tripoli and the North, said he would stay abroad after receiving information that he could be the target of an assassination plot.

“Some security officials advised me to stay currently outside Lebanon,” Shaar told a local TV. Shaar was in Vienna participating in the inauguration of King Abdullah Interfaith Dialogue Center.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Prunus persica »

.


Respect, Stability

1221-Hezbollah-stronghold-Lebanese-Christians_full_380.jpg
1221-Hezbollah-stronghold-Lebanese-Christians_full_380.jpg (22.44 KiB) Viewed 3505 times
Randa Gholam, a Christian living the Hezbollah stronghold neighborhood of Harat Hreik, stands next to a poster of Hasan Nasrallah in her home on November 15, in Beirut, Lebanon. Gholam supports and admires Hezbollah leader, Sheikh Hassan Nasrallah, and says she feels and free to worship as a Christian in a predominately Shiite neighborhood.

:lol:

In a home in a Shiite neighborhood in southern Beirut, images of Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah share mantel and wall space with the Virgin Mary

The face of the revered Shiite militant leader appears on posters, a calendar, and in several photographs nestled amid those of Christian homeowner Randa Gholam's family members. Mr. Nasrallah is, Ms. Gholam asserts amid a string of superlatives, “a gift from God.”

“I feel honored to be here. They are honest. They are not extremists. It’s not like everyone describes,” Gholam says. “I can speak on behalf of all my Christian friends. They would say the same thing."

more @ link

.

No, not talking to Monster , talkin to Hans

Well, Hans .. Christians love Lebanese Shia


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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Hans Bulvai »

Oh Azari.

There are plenty of the opposite among the Christians in Lebanon.
This guy Auon is an durian. First he was fighting the Syrians and Hezbollah in the late 80's now he is their ally. :lol:

The Lebanese Christians are pretty much split down the middle. The Druze are not on the Hezbollah side either.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Typhoon »

Bloody hell.



One can catch a glimpse of the shock front - blast pressure wave - travelling at the speed of sound before it strikes the car.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by kmich »

Beirut blast: Tracing the explosives that tore the capital apart.

Letters show officials knew of danger posed by ammonium nitrate cargo at Beirut port six years before deadly blast.

oKFupx9x0-k
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Doc »

Colonel Sun wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 4:25 am Bloody hell.



One can catch a glimpse of the shock front - blast pressure wave - travelling at the speed of sound before it strikes the car.
Seems like it left a massive crater. From the aerial video at least 100 meters in diameter.

Crater circled in Red:
bc1.jpg
bc1.jpg (115.06 KiB) Viewed 3186 times
bc2.jpg
bc2.jpg (117.45 KiB) Viewed 3186 times
Before the blast --- No crater:
bc3.jpg
bc3.jpg (56.79 KiB) Viewed 3186 times
07_KdDdcVfM

2700 tons of Ammonia Nitrate. Hezbollah controls that port and everyone in the government knew it was there. There since 2014. That would make one hell of a car bomb.

Funny thing is that Ammonia Nitrate requires a catalyst to explode violently. One that is well mixed up with the ammonia Nitrate. Exploding fireworks are not a catalyst. More likely fuel oil.

That would imply that the explosion was intentional. That someone with lots of access to the warehouse had to have done it. Meant to throw Lebanon into chaos once again.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Doc »

kmich wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 6:01 pm Beirut blast: Tracing the explosives that tore the capital apart.

Letters show officials knew of danger posed by ammonium nitrate cargo at Beirut port six years before deadly blast.

oKFupx9x0-k
From this slow-mo version you can see the incredible force of the explosion. It look like one of the meteor strike in the movie Armageddon

Compare that to the OK city Ammonia Nitrate bombing with a 30 foot crater that was 8 feet deep.
Image

As I recall they only could identify the truck when they found the rear truck axle a 500 feet away from the blast. It weighed 250 pounds
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Typhoon »

As always, civilians who were simply going about their daily lives were the unfortunate victims.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by noddy »

Doc wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 6:23 pm
Funny thing is that Ammonia Nitrate requires a catalyst to explode violently. One that is well mixed up with the ammonia Nitrate. Exploding fireworks are not a catalyst. More likely fuel oil.

That would imply that the explosion was intentional. That someone with lots of access to the warehouse had to have done it. Meant to throw Lebanon into chaos once again.
I thought that aswell but the member of my family who is a professional shotfirer says that it can work without fuel oil if it gets got enough to melt.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Doc »

noddy wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 8:35 am
Doc wrote: Wed Aug 05, 2020 6:23 pm
Funny thing is that Ammonia Nitrate requires a catalyst to explode violently. One that is well mixed up with the ammonia Nitrate. Exploding fireworks are not a catalyst. More likely fuel oil.

That would imply that the explosion was intentional. That someone with lots of access to the warehouse had to have done it. Meant to throw Lebanon into chaos once again.
I thought that aswell but the member of my family who is a professional shotfirer says that it can work without fuel oil if it gets got enough to melt.
So it seems.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonium_nitrate_disaster

Though I was watching a bomb "expert" on CNN state that if it had been a terrorist bomb the "smoke" in the blast wave would have been black not white.
Which is seemingly complete BS as the white in the super sonic shock wave is water condensing out of the air as an effect of the blast wave. Much like this:

k4IzBIezhB4

When the "experts" lie I always smell fish.


Also just to see how devestating this explosion was, half way down this article from CNN is a photo graphic of the port with a slider in the middle that shows the before and after if you slide it left and right.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/06/middleea ... index.html
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Typhoon »

Visual Capitalist | The history of ammonium nitrate explosions

Also
[Sci Am] For combustion to occur, oxygen must be present. Ammonium nitrate prills provide a much more concentrated supply of oxygen than the air around us. This is why it is effective in mining explosives, where it’s mixed with oil and other fuels.

At high enough temperatures, however, ammonium nitrate can violently decompose on its own. This process creates gases including nitrogen oxides and water vapour. It is this rapid release of gases that causes an explosion.

Ammonium nitrate decomposition can be set off if an explosion occurs where it’s stored, if there is an intense fire nearby. The latter is what happened in the 2015 Tianjin explosion, which killed 173 people after flammable chemicals and ammonium nitrate were stored together at a chemicals factory in eastern China.

While we don’t know for sure what caused the explosion in Beirut, footage of the incident indicates it may have been set off by a fire – visible in a section of the city’s port area before the explosion happened.

It’s relatively difficult for a fire to trigger an ammonium nitrate explosion. The fire would need to be sustained and confined within the same area as the ammonium nitrate prills.

Also, the prills themselves are not fuel for the fire, so they would need to be contaminated with, or packaged in, some other combustible material.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Doc »

Colonel Sun wrote: Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:53 am Visual Capitalist | The history of ammonium nitrate explosions

Also
[Sci Am] For combustion to occur, oxygen must be present. Ammonium nitrate prills provide a much more concentrated supply of oxygen than the air around us. This is why it is effective in mining explosives, where it’s mixed with oil and other fuels.

At high enough temperatures, however, ammonium nitrate can violently decompose on its own. This process creates gases including nitrogen oxides and water vapour. It is this rapid release of gases that causes an explosion.

Ammonium nitrate decomposition can be set off if an explosion occurs where it’s stored, if there is an intense fire nearby. The latter is what happened in the 2015 Tianjin explosion, which killed 173 people after flammable chemicals and ammonium nitrate were stored together at a chemicals factory in eastern China.

While we don’t know for sure what caused the explosion in Beirut, footage of the incident indicates it may have been set off by a fire – visible in a section of the city’s port area before the explosion happened.

It’s relatively difficult for a fire to trigger an ammonium nitrate explosion. The fire would need to be sustained and confined within the same area as the ammonium nitrate prills.

Also, the prills themselves are not fuel for the fire, so they would need to be contaminated with, or packaged in, some other combustible material.
I saw a quick view of the Ammonium Nitrate in Beirut before it exploded. It appear to be in giant dumpster sized bags. The bags gave me the impression of Burlap.

They said that fireworks were stored in the adjacent building. That is where the fire started. Perhaps mortar rounds of fireworks were thrown into the AN and then exploded.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Simple Minded »

Thanks doc. I was wondering about that. I thought 2700 tons of AN? Is it in 100 Sealand containers with 27 tons per container? How in the world could you get 100 sealant containers to detonate simultaneously?

Somebody never heard the concept of "critical mass."
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Doc »

Simple Minded wrote: Fri Aug 07, 2020 4:23 pm Thanks doc. I was wondering about that. I thought 2700 tons of AN? Is it in 100 Sealand containers with 27 tons per container? How in the world could you get 100 sealant containers to detonate simultaneously?

Somebody never heard the concept of "critical mass."
Large initial "primer" explosion slams into large bags of AN. AN compresses bags, catches on fire. The thing that makes Ammonium Nitrate so dangerous is the speed at which it burns.(Read explodes) Apparently all you have to do is compress it. Like all you have to do to make Nitro glycerin explode is to shake it.
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Re: The Lebanon Thread

Post by Simple Minded »

Doc wrote: Sun Aug 09, 2020 2:49 am
Simple Minded wrote: Fri Aug 07, 2020 4:23 pm Thanks doc. I was wondering about that. I thought 2700 tons of AN? Is it in 100 Sealand containers with 27 tons per container? How in the world could you get 100 sealant containers to detonate simultaneously?

Somebody never heard the concept of "critical mass."
Large initial "primer" explosion slams into large bags of AN. AN compresses bags, catches on fire. The thing that makes Ammonium Nitrate so dangerous is the speed at which it burns.(Read explodes) Apparently all you have to do is compress it. Like all you have to do to make Nitro glycerin explode is to shake it.
sounds like Tannerite.

https://tannerite.com/
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