Capitalism and Its Discontents

Now, what news on the Rialto?

Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:25 am

noddy wrote:how so ? it reads like another 'one world consciousness' thing to me, which is nice, but hard to legislate :P

we are in moderated middle, any change will be a more radical left or more radical right choice, by definition.

i want more a more radical free market choice, just because that upsets you doesnt mean im not going to keep wanting more free in my freedom (tm).

i get the sense that you have the more extreme version of robber barron capitalism than us, so your society might need more of a radical lefty overhaul - their isnt much thats simmilar about romania and australia politically :)

it will still be a radical change, all the good changes are!


I don't disagree. I just dislike the way the debate had been monopolized by these radical choices.

"If you don't accept radical free market capitalism, you're automatically a Communist!" :|
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:28 am

YMix wrote:
noddy wrote:how so ? it reads like another 'one world consciousness' thing to me, which is nice, but hard to legislate :P

we are in moderated middle, any change will be a more radical left or more radical right choice, by definition.

i want more a more radical free market choice, just because that upsets you doesnt mean im not going to keep wanting more free in my freedom (tm).

i get the sense that you have the more extreme version of robber barron capitalism than us, so your society might need more of a radical lefty overhaul - their isnt much thats simmilar about romania and australia politically :)

it will still be a radical change, all the good changes are!


I don't disagree. I just dislike the way the debate had been monopolized by these radical choices.

"If you don't accept radical free market capitalism, you're automatically a Communist!" :|


The Pope is right to criticize the two radical camps without allowing them to define his message.
“There are a lot of killers. We’ve got a lot of killers. What, do you think our country’s so innocent? Take a look at what we’ve done, too.” - Donald J. Trump, President of the USA
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Simple Minded » Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:21 pm

YMix wrote:
YMix wrote:
noddy wrote:how so ? it reads like another 'one world consciousness' thing to me, which is nice, but hard to legislate :P

we are in moderated middle, any change will be a more radical left or more radical right choice, by definition.

i want more a more radical free market choice, just because that upsets you doesnt mean im not going to keep wanting more free in my freedom (tm).

i get the sense that you have the more extreme version of robber barron capitalism than us, so your society might need more of a radical lefty overhaul - their isnt much thats simmilar about romania and australia politically :)

it will still be a radical change, all the good changes are!


I don't disagree. I just dislike the way the debate had been monopolized by these radical choices.

"If you don't accept radical free market capitalism, you're automatically a Communist!" :|


The Pope is right to criticize the two radical camps without allowing them to define his message.


There's only two radical camps? :shock:

I thought I was the only moderate, and everyone else was a radical! :?

Luckily, they all think the same way! So, really, "us" is a much, much bigger group than "they" think we are.

As long as there are more of "us" than there are of "them," that gives "me" hope for the future. :D

and that is a good thing, right? ;)

Besides, anyone who disagrees with the Pope is going to Hell anyway........
Last edited by Simple Minded on Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Fri Jun 12, 2015 4:36 pm

There was a lot to celebrate in the Magic Kingdom this year. The Disney Corporation had its most profitable year ever, with profits of $7.5 billion—up 22 percent from the previous year. Disney’s stock price is up approximately 150 percent over the past three years. These kinds of results have paid off handsomely for its CEO Bob Iger, who took home $46 million in compensation last year.

Disney prides itself on its recipe for “delighting customers,” a recipe it says includes putting employees first. They tout this as a key to their success in creating “a culture where going the extra mile for customers comes naturally” for employees. One method of creating this culture is referring to its employees as “cast members.” In fact, Disney is so proud of its organizational culture that it’s even created an institute to share its magic with other businesses (for a consulting fee, of course).

So, you would expect a firm that puts its employees first to share the vast prosperity that’s been created with the very employees who went above and beyond to help generate those record profits.

Well, how did Mr. Iger repay his workers—sorry, I mean cast members—for creating all this profit? Not with bonuses and a big raises. Instead, as the New York Times just detailed in a major report, he forced hundreds of them to train their own replacements—temporary foreign workers here on H-1B guestworker visas—before he laid them off.

[...]
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The Perversion of Capitalism

Postby Nonc Hilaire » Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:03 pm

Ideologies are mind-killers, all of them, because they are all (severely) flawed. The ideological labels which are so frequently parroted in our societies are terminology which has lost all meaning. This begins with the fact that our political/economic ideologies are not practical blueprints for creating and managing economies (and societies).

These ultra-popular buzzwords are the theoretical models of philosophers. With philosophy (and philosophers) now banished to the lowest rung in the world of academia; how can the work of philosophers be regarded as the (supposed) epitome of political and economic wisdom, in these same societies?

The other reason why these political/economic buzzwords do much more to confuse than enlighten comes from the fact that most of the people who bandy about these terms have little-to-no idea of what these theoretical models actually represent. Nothing illustrates this principle better than the grossly-abused buzzword “capitalism”.

As always; sound analysis begins with definition of terms. What is “capitalism”?

a) Capitalism is competition.

b) Capitalism is free markets.

c) Capitalism is a system of equal (economic) opportunity, an inevitable byproduct of having free markets and competition.

What do we see in our own, supposedly “capitalist” systems?

We see the opposite of competition. We see economies which have been almost entirely carved-up into the domains of a handful of mega-oligopolies.

We see the opposite of free markets. We see markets where a single, financial crime syndicate marches these markets (collectively) higher and lower, like some gigantic, synchronized yo-yo. Bubble and crash. Bubble and crash. Every eight years.

We see the opposite of equal opportunity. We see an economic system where the deck is ridiculously stacked in favor of engorging the oligopolies still further, and throttling small business and the individual entrepreneur.

In real capitalist systems; oligopolies (and monopolies) are the Ultimate Evil, and we have very strong laws in all our regimes, to prevent these economic abominations from ever coming into existence. In our pseudo-capitalist perversion; these corrupt governments have simply refused to continue to enforce these laws. Instead, our traitor regimes worship the oligopolies (and the Oligarchs who hide behind these corporate fronts). “Too big to fail” has become the mantra of all.

In real capitalist systems; there is no such thing as too-big-to-fail, only too big to exist. Corrupt and/or insolvent entities are supposed to be put to death, as the sole mechanism for purging malinvestment, and restoring economic health to that system.

Japan is the proof of this principle (and proof of our own perversion of it), in reverse. A quarter century of “too big to fail” has brought nothing but perpetual economic stagnation, and skyrocketing debt. Western economies reinforced that proof, by copying Japan’s failure, and copying Japan’s consequences: skyrocketing debt and perpetual stagnation (at best).

As a matter of simple arithmetic; nations with skyrocketing national debts must implode into debt default. As a matter of simple arithmetic: nations with skyrocketing debt and stagnant economies must implode much, much sooner.

How perverted has the term “capitalism” become? How meaningless? As noted in a recent commentary; we have two economic models which are both (universally) described as “capitalist”. Yet not only are these models different (entrepreneurial capitalism and neo-feudalist capitalism) they are opposite to each other. As a matter of elementary logic; no concept, model or system can be its own opposite.

However; there is an even more-fundamental perversion of our pseudo-capitalist system. It is a principle so fundamental that by itself it is responsible for the cancerous, parasitic rot, in our once-thriving/once-prosperous societies.

“Capitalism”, as the word directly implies is a system of capital. Why do we hail those successful (crooked?) enough to accumulate wealth (i.e. capital)? Because in any/every real capitalist system; these entrepreneurs invest this wealth directly, back into the system. We rarely see this, in our pseudo-capitalist perversion.

What we have instead, openly acknowledged by the bankers, politicians, and media drones alike is “a credit-based system”. Why is a credit-based system a perversion of a capital-based system (i.e. real capitalism)? In one word: interest.

Real capitalism, where the wealthy invest their wealth (i.e. capital) directly into the system, is a clean system. Every penny of that capital goes directly into generating new economic growth, new jobs, new wealth, and more prosperity. But what we have instead is a grossly inferior, totally parasitic, and hopelessly unsustainable version of this model: creditism.

In creditism (as opposed to capitalism); wealth is not invested directly into the economy. Rather, it is loaned into the economy, and thus virtually every penny of actual investment is encumbered by useless, parasitic debt.

As a matter of simple arithmetic; we can predict what must result from any government foolish enough to adopt inferior/parasitic/unsustainable creditism, rather than adhering (more or less) to the principles of true capitalism. All such economies must end up drowning in debt. Every increment of investment means an increase in debt, and thus an increase in (parasitic) interest payments, compounded, in perpetuity. The result is obvious to anyone with sufficient intellectual firepower to operate a calculator.

Look around us, and what do we see? We see Lemming Regimes, proving this elementary principle, perpetuating the same, failed system (creditism) which – as a matter of simple arithmetic – must result in our complete economic destruction. Total suicide.

The epitome of his insanity, perversion, and suicide is the surreal melodrama known as “the Greek crisis”. What do we see here? We see an economy which everyone agrees is bankrupt. And what do the “creditors” of this economy (the ECB, EU, and IMF) demand that Greece agree to? Taking on much more debt.

Here the arithmetic descends to the level of fingers-and-toes. A bankrupt entity – by definition – cannot afford to continue to service its present debts; at all, period. Obviously (using one’s fingers and toes) it’s easy to “calculate” that such an entity cannot possibly take on even one more penny of additional debt.

In this perverted, pseudo-capitalism which we can only call “creditism”; the solution to bankruptcy is more debt. Total suicide. Absolute insanity.

What does (real) capitalism preach? The solution to insolvency is always (without exception, ever) to “restructure the debt”. Here we can divide insolvency into two categories: those where it is necessary/desirable for the insolvent entity to continue its existence, and those where it is necessary/desirable for the entities to be liquidated (i.e. the “too big to fail” Big Banks).

Where it is necessary/desirable for the entity to continue its existence (as is the case with any sovereign nation); capitalism dictates that the “restructuring” reduce the debt-level down to (clearly) manageable proportions – without exception, ever.

What have we seen Greece’s (new) government insisting upon, as it attempts to negotiate with the insane, corrupt “Troika”? It wants its debts reduced to manageable (i.e. post-Austerity) proportions. For this; the corporate media has relentlessly and unequivocally labeled Greece’s government as being “radical, left-wing”.

Greece’s negotiating position is the only negotiating position for any rational/reasonable entity, in any (real) capitalist system. The Corporate media characterizes Greece’s capitalist proposal as being “radical, left-wing”. This can only mean, in the insane perversion of creditism, that true capitalism itself (competition; free markets; equal opportunity) is now equated as being “radical, left-wing”.

In such a world of institutionalized insanity; it behooves us all to cease to use the ideological buzzword “capitalism”. As has been clearly demonstrated, this word is now nothing more than a perverted euphemism used by corrupt Liars – to attempt to deceive the brainwashed masses into accepting (and even endorsing) policies which are the antithesis of everything that our economies and societies used to represent.


Say “no” to the perversion and propagandizing of the term capitalism. Instead, demand that our corrupt governments openly acknowledge our creditist system (in honest, non-euphemistic language) for what this really is: parasitic, cannibalistic, suicidal, insanity.


http://www.sprottmoney.com/blog/the-per ... elson.html
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Typhoon » Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:15 pm

Negative interest rates | 'Neglected Prophet' of Economics Got It Right

In some parts of Europe, negative interest rates are creating absurd situations. In France, some corporate bonds pay interest to the issuer because they were linked to a benchmark rate that has dropped below zero. In Sweden, Denmark and Switzerland, banks are turning depositors away with threats of negative interest rates. If this goes on much longer, we'll be living in the world of "free money" imagined by the economic dreamer and adventurer Silvio Gesell in the 19th century.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Mr. Perfect » Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:50 pm

Looks like STPN isn't working out.
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Re: The Perversion of Capitalism

Postby Mr. Perfect » Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:53 pm

Nonc Hilaire wrote:
Ideologies are mind-killers, all of them, because they are all (severely) flawed.

Sort of an ideology all unto itself.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby noddy » Sat Jul 04, 2015 2:54 am

i thought fear was the mindkiller and you needed ideology to push your way through it.

damn, them mindkillers are lurking everywhere... sneeky little buggers.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Endovelico » Sat Jul 04, 2015 10:23 am

noddy wrote:i thought fear was the mindkiller and you needed ideology to push your way through it.

damn, them mindkillers are lurking everywhere... sneeky little buggers.


Trouble with ideology is that it does not focus on what is, but on what some people believe it is... Believing the Earth is flat does not make it so...

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:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Typhoon » Mon Jul 13, 2015 8:09 pm

All the world's a stage.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Simple Minded » Tue Jul 14, 2015 12:48 pm



Excellent article. Thanks!

Yet another data point that people manage their own affairs and assets better than the mob manages society's assets and affairs.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Wed Aug 05, 2015 3:46 pm



Pretty long article.

Comment by GB, London

We used to fly the Zimbabwe roses (and some Zambian) to the Dutch auctions; about 100 tonnes a week on Boeing 747s. Ours were cut, trimmed and boxed, and we delivered them to Amsterdam very early in the morning so that they could make the auction at the flower market in Aalsmeer that morning.

The Dutch control the flower producers in Africa as well. We spoke with some friends in Russia who wanted to import the roses directly into Russia, avoiding the Dutch middlemen. They were incensed that the price the Zimbabwean growers earned from the roses was less than a quarter of the delivered price to Russia – an important flower consumer; especially on Women’s Day.

I went to the local growers and offered to buy their roses to send to Russia. I was willing to pay a premium to the Zim growers over what they were getting in Holland.

They met and told me that they couldn’t sell to me directly because the rootstock for their roses came originally from Holland. A clause in their contract for the supply of the rootstock provided a lien on the flowers to the Dutch suppliers. This allowed them only to sell to the Dutch flower association. I tried in Zambia and Kenya. In all three the Dutch had monopolised the purchase of the roses through their control of the rootstock.

The Dutch flower mafia is a specialised licensed monopoly and very hard to compete with, as they have these strong restrictions on Dutch varietal roses from Dutch rootstock. If the Russians can break this monopolistic hold it would be a godsend to the Africans, and save Russia a fortune on the price of flowers.


Parodite?
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Wed Aug 05, 2015 4:36 pm

A delicious article. :)

Immigration is the answer to Europe’s demographic crisis
By Victoria Bateman

If there is one problem the world does not face, it is too few people. There are already more than seven billion of us – and the number is only set to increase. And yet, if you believe the headlines, you would think that we were suffering from a serious people shortage. Not so long ago, Newsweek announced that the choice to be childless was “bad for America”, and with births per woman having fallen below 2.1 in many rich nations (the level needed to maintain current population levels), women are effectively being encouraged to lie back and think of their motherland.

“Breaking the baby strike” was how last week’s The Economist described policy initiatives, which include cash inducements (of the kind used by Singapore and now Turkey), subsidised child care (always popular in Scandinavia and increasingly so in the UK), additional paid leave and even national fertility boosting songs and, in Russia, an annual day earmarked for baby-making. The supposed logic – that our economies are in trouble as a result of women choosing to have too few children – is simply nonsense. The idea that the falling fertility of women in rich countries is a serious threat to our economy is not only narrow-minded, it is also potentially very damaging.

Yes, it certainly is true to say that there is a sex problem. But the problem is not too little sex but too much of it – something which is contributing to lowering the wages of those at the bottom of the ladder, stunting investment and economic growth, raising house prices and increasing the costs of many other things besides (many of which might help explain why some couples are choosing to have fewer children in the first place).

If our governments were to remove their blinkers and consider population from the perspective of the globe rather than from their own national interest, they would soon realise that all they are doing is encouraging women to behave in a way that simply adds further to a world already awash with people. Rather than helping to solve a (non-existent) “problem”, policymakers are blindly choosing to add to an existing one. It is illogical and unnecessary. By trying to bribe women in rich countries to have more kids than they would otherwise freely choose, we are potentially making women less happy whilst making the world economy worse off too – where is the sense in that?

The reality is that if certain countries really do face a population shortage relative to others, then there are plenty of people out there literally knocking on the gates of the richer countries, desperate to come in. Whether it is boats crossing the Mediterranean or lorries coming through the Channel Tunnel, you see it in the press almost ever day. But, of course, to take the immigration option involves standing up to the anti-immigration lobby, a lobby that is only growing stronger with time.

Here in Britain, and according to a recent British Social Attitudes Survey, 77% of people would like to see immigration reduced, which compares with 63% in 1995. So, with growing antagonism towards foreigners, and not just here in the UK, governments seem to think it is better to lean on domestic women rather than to make the case for greater internationalism and cosmopolitanism. Now, it is one thing to encourage we women to lie on our backs and think of our country if we really are in need of more people, but quite another if not.

So, to governments across the western world I say “hands off my fertility”. It is time to stop perverting women’s – and indeed couples’ – choices about their own fertility. Rather than relying on moral suasion and interfering with and so distorting the market to help solve a supposed fertility problem, governments would instead do well to stop perverting the international market for people. By excessively interfering with the flow of people, the governments of rich countries are boxing themselves into a corner and having to then interfere with perhaps the most important decision we all make, and certainly one that has major consequences on the lives of women: whether to have children and how many.

Stop blaming the so-called “problem” on women when the problem is instead the anti-immigration stance of the political debate, a stance which runs counter to letting market forces do their magic.

Women across the western world unite: tell your governments that your womb is your own – tell them to keep out!

Dr Victoria Bateman, Economic Historian and Fellow in Economics, Gonville & Caius College, Cambridge, and Fellow of the Legatum Institute, London.


The evil governments are "perverting the international market for people" in order to satisfy the anti-immigration lobby. :lol:
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Nonc Hilaire » Wed Aug 05, 2015 5:25 pm

In my experience 'anti-immigration' = 'anti-foreign worker'.

I have never seen a fuss about adopting foreign children. They are properly supported and socialized.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Simple Minded » Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:42 pm

YMix wrote:A delicious article. :)

Immigration is the answer to Europe’s demographic crisis
By Victoria Bateman

......

Stop blaming the so-called “problem” on women when the problem is instead the anti-immigration stance of the political debate, a stance which runs counter to letting market forces do their magic.

Women across the western world unite: tell your governments that your womb is your own – tell them to keep out!

Dr Victoria Bateman, Economic Historian and Fellow in Economics, Gonville & Caius College, Cambridge, and Fellow of the Legatum Institute, London.


The evil governments are "perverting the international market for people" in order to satisfy the anti-immigration lobby. :lol:


Keep out? "I don't wanna have a baby! So don't try to bribe me!" Victoria Bateman That ain't what we call it in the hood Girl!

Come on in? "I demand my free birth control/abortion!" Sandra Fluke

Western women seem to be waging a war on women. PMS.... maybe?
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Nonc Hilaire » Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:06 pm

Free birth control is a good idea. Especially for men.

If we can develop Viagra, why not a male BC pill? I would think a guaranteed, "You are NOT the father!" would be attractive to the average player.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Simple Minded » Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:24 pm

Nonc Hilaire wrote:Free birth control is a good idea. Especially for men.

If we can develop Viagra, why not a male BC pill? I would think a guaranteed, "You are NOT the father!" would be attractive to the average player.


especially if during the effective period, your nose had a green tint to it so all females would know you are not.... infectious.

What was the cost to develop and get Viagra to market? Would that be considered an un-PC product?

Like offering free sterilization to any who are interested?
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby Mr. Perfect » Thu Aug 06, 2015 9:12 am

Nonc Hilaire wrote:Free birth control is a good idea. Especially for men.

Who then will pay your social security.

If we can develop Viagra, why not a male BC pill?

Because it's difficult? Why don't you develop a male bc pill.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Tue Sep 22, 2015 2:56 pm

CEO who raised price of 62-year-old pill $735 calls journalist a ‘moron’ for asking why

Ever since an HIV/AIDS patient advocacy group began raising questions last week about why Turing Pharmaceuticals jacked up the price for a medication from $13.50 per pill to $750 overnight, anger against the company has been boiling over.

The medicine, Daraprim, which has been on the market for 62 years, is the standard of care for a food-borne illness called called toxoplasmosis caused by a parasite that can severely affect those with compromised immune systems. Turing purchased the rights to the drug last month and almost immediately raised prices.

Alarmed consumers took to Reddit to call for a boycott of the company’s products (with some pointing out that it’s hard to boycott a drug if you’ll die without it) and calling for new laws to prevent this kind of thing from happening in the future.

Judith Aberg, a spokesperson for the HIV Medicine Association, has calculated that even patients with insurance could wind up paying $150 per pill out of pocket. “This is a tremendous increase,” she told USA Today.

The New York Times reported that Alberg’s group and the Infectious Diseases Society of America wrote in a joint letter to Turing earlier this month complaining that the price increase is “unjustifiable for the medically vulnerable patient population” and “unsustainable for the health care system.”

The news even got the attention of Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton, who called the pricing “outrageous” and promised that she had a plan to take on the issue. Clinton is scheduled to unveil a highly anticipated drug pricing proposal Tuesday:

“Price gouging like this in the specialty drug market is outrageous. Tomorrow I’ll lay out a plan to take it on.”

The tweet drew strong reaction from Wall Street, sending the Nasdaq biotech index down 4.41 per cent on Monday.

Turing spokesman Craig Rothenberg has said the company will use the money from the sales to further research treatments for toxoplasmosis, which he said has long been neglected. He also said the firm had plans to invest in marketing and education tools to raise awareness of the disease — a reasonable and reasoned answer, but one that has been unsatisfactory for many.

(In an interview with The Washington Post on Monday, the company said the pill is actually $18 a tablet so the price increase is 4,100 per cent. Media outlets had previously reported that the jump was more than 5,000 per cent if based on an original price of $13.50.)

John Carroll, the editor of Fierce Biotech, a daily newsletter about the industry, was one of the first to ask Turing chief executive Martin Shkreli directly to explain the move. In a hot-headed Twitter exchange over the weekend, Shkreli declined to provide additional information and instead launched into a series of personal attacks against Carroll — calling him “irrelevant” and someone who doesn’t “think logically.”

Carroll tweeted, “Let’s see if we can get a statement from @MartinShkreli. Martin, your co. just hiked the price of an old drug — new to you — by 5000%. Why?”

To which Shkreli responded, “@JohnCFierce You are such a moron.”
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Tue Sep 22, 2015 2:58 pm

After hiking TB drug price from $500 a bottle to $10,800, company agrees to return rights to non-profit

A huge overnight price increase for an important tuberculosis drug has been rescinded after the company that acquired the drug gave it back to its previous owner under pressure, it was announced Monday.

However, outrage over a gigantic price increase for another drug spread into the political sphere Monday, causing biotechnology stocks to fall broadly as investors worried about possible government action to control pharmaceutical prices. The Nasdaq Biotechnology Index fell more than four per cent.

[...]

Cycloserine was acquired last month by Rodelis Therapeutics, which promptly raised the price to $10,800 for 30 capsules, from $500. But the company agreed to return the drug to its former owner, a non-profit organization affiliated with Purdue University, the organization said Monday.

“We discovered literally on Thursday the strategy that had been undertaken” by Rodelis, said Dan Hasler, the president of the Purdue Research Foundation, which has oversight of the manufacturing operation. “We said this was not what we had intended.”

By Saturday, he said, Rodelis had agreed to give back the drug. Rodelis confirmed this in a brief statement on its website.

The foundation now will charge $1,050 for 30 capsules, twice what it charged before, but far less than Rodelis was charging. Hasler said the new price was needed to stem losses.

Cycloserine is used to treat multidrug-resistant tuberculosis, a serious form of the disease that does not respond to the usual drugs. There are only about 90 new cases a year in the United States, Hasler said, and about half those patients get treated with cycloserine.

[...]
“There are a lot of killers. We’ve got a lot of killers. What, do you think our country’s so innocent? Take a look at what we’ve done, too.” - Donald J. Trump, President of the USA
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Tue Sep 22, 2015 3:06 pm

VW shares crash 20% on emissions cheating scandal

Shares in Volkswagen crashed 20% Monday, wiping 16 billion euros ($18 billion) off the company's value after it was found to have misled U.S. regulators.

Federal and state regulators said Friday that the German company cheated on environmental standards by programming some diesel-fueled cars to turn on emission controls only when being tested.

Volkswagen, recently crowned the world's biggest carmaker by sales, also owns the Audi and Porsche brands.

The software is installed in nearly 500,000 cars on U.S. roads, including some of its luxury-brand Audi cars.

"The vehicles [with this software] would run 10 to 40 times more emissions than showing in the test," said Andrew Lee, an autos specialist at consultants Frost & Sullivan.



It's not surprising that its the US gov that busted VWs ass, because thanks to the non-laws for emission testing in the EU, looking away is routine. The relevant text was made on german desks of course.

And of course most of this is crocodile tears. It's an open secret that car manufacturers across the globe systematically cheat on emission tests. Just last year the ICC found[1] that the real emissions of modern 'Euro-6' diesels are 7 times higher than the threshold on average. Most cars shouldn't even be sold, according to EU laws. Another thing is that cheating on these tests is also tax fraud - CO2 emission values are significant for the KfZ-Steuer ('car tax'). But nobody cares about that in germany, our 'green chancellor' has a big heart for car manufacturers.

And probably every one who has to pay for his real world fuel consumption knows that the 'offical measurements' from the car manufacturers are total crap. It's not that we somehow drive wrong, the measuring is. The 'Deutsche Umwelthilfe' hands out a leaflet[2] containing all the little tricks used by car manufacturers (german only). On Average a car consumes 25% more fuel than the official figure. And if you burn more fuel, you emit more toxic crap.

This, of course, does not not factor in crappy diesel cars, which have much higher emission far far beyond the legal limits in both the EU and the US. Especially the limits for fine dust and nitrogen oxides are big problems for diesel engines. For example, the legal limit according to Euro-6 for new diesels is a maximum emission of 80mg/km. Obviously every single Diesel sold these days goes below that limit in the official tests. For normal use the emission values are much above those 80 mg/km: Last year the ICC tested 15 different Euro-6 compliant Diesels from 6 different manufacturers under normal use conditions. Only a single car met Euro-6, the other 14 were above that by up to a factor of 25. Six wouldn't have managed Euro-3 (2001) and three of those wouldn't even have passed Euro-1 (1999). If we speculate that this test is representative, it means that the emissions of 1/5th of all new Diesels being sold today are so bad they shouldn't even been sold 22 years ago. Is it really that suprising that the EPA now found out that VW-Diesels are 40 times above the US-limits?

BMW was caught pants down aswell[3]. Their software has a special modus that detects whether the bike is being tested and manipulates the fuel inject accordingly. Of course you can't drive the bike that way. It only exists so BMW can pass the emission tests. Their bikes aren't allowed to drive on either US or EU roads. It's very unlikely, BMW doesn't use the same 'technology' in their cars.

So. If the media now asks, if this comncerns 'just' VW and 'only' in the US - that's plenty naive. The ICC tests show that cheating on emission tests is systematical for many (if not all) car manufacturers. If the EU was really concerned about the environment and the health of her citizens, she would need to retest all diesel cars (and probably all gasoline cars), which would likely result in a prohibition of sale for all current cars. That's obviously not gonna happen.

The german chancellor is known as St. Angela of the car manufacturers, holding her shielding hands above the industry. VW will repent and be sacrificed as a pawn, and once TTIP hits all these emission laws are void anyway.

[1] http://www.theicct.org/sites/default/fi ... 141013.pdf
[2] http://www.duh.de/uploads/tx_duhdownloa ... uchPKW.pdf
[3] http://www.motorradonline.de/motorraede ... ung/105838
“There are a lot of killers. We’ve got a lot of killers. What, do you think our country’s so innocent? Take a look at what we’ve done, too.” - Donald J. Trump, President of the USA
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby noddy » Wed Sep 23, 2015 7:55 am

does the pharma-suit-icles industry actually have any capitalism in it ?

i wasnt aware of it , i thought they where the poster boys of corrupt relationships with government and abuse of the legal system.
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby YMix » Wed Sep 23, 2015 8:04 am

noddy wrote:does the pharma-suit-icles industry actually have any capitalism in it ?

i wasnt aware of it , i thought they where the poster boys of corrupt relationships with government and abuse of the legal system.


I thought that was capitalism. :)
“There are a lot of killers. We’ve got a lot of killers. What, do you think our country’s so innocent? Take a look at what we’ve done, too.” - Donald J. Trump, President of the USA
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Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents

Postby noddy » Wed Sep 23, 2015 8:10 am

YMix wrote:
noddy wrote:does the pharma-suit-icles industry actually have any capitalism in it ?

i wasnt aware of it , i thought they where the poster boys of corrupt relationships with government and abuse of the legal system.


I thought that was capitalism. :)


an oligopoly of oligarchs ogles all the things.

on a more serious note, patent law is one of those broken things noone seems to have the balls to fix.
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