Re: Capitalism and Its Discontents
Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 8:57 am
"Happy Birthday" Copyright Ruled to Be Invalidnoddy wrote:on a more serious note, patent law is one of those broken things noone seems to have the balls to fix.
Another day in the Universe
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https://www.onthenatureofthings.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=366
"Happy Birthday" Copyright Ruled to Be Invalidnoddy wrote:on a more serious note, patent law is one of those broken things noone seems to have the balls to fix.
And you would be wrong. If you understood capitalism you would probably join us. I have some books for you when you are ready.YMix wrote:I thought that was capitalism.noddy wrote:does the pharma-suit-icles industry actually have any capitalism in it ?
i wasnt aware of it , i thought they where the poster boys of corrupt relationships with government and abuse of the legal system.
What if I'm not wrong?Mr. Perfect wrote:And you would be wrong. If you understood capitalism you would probably join us. I have some books for you when you are ready.
Oligopolies, duopolies, and monopolies are all natural occurrences in a capitalist system (and do not require government to exist). They arise from human behavior and the constraints within which we operate. Perfect competition is not the equilibrium state for many (most?) enterprises, especially those where a high degree of differentiation exists. Capitalism is merely the system where capital is privately owned and employed with voluntary labor to produce profits that are then distributed to owners and labor according to consensual, mutual agreements. No guarantees, implied or express, about the fairness and equity of such arrangements.noddy wrote:if your not wrong then words like fascism and oligarchy and corruption dont mean anything, which is nice.
in the university economics course i did they taught us that when you only had a few players (oligopoly) or less than that (duopoly,monopoly) then its no longer a proper capitalist market and starts to behave awfully fascist/communist.
big pharma is a text book example of an oligoply of established players which have total lockin with government legislation and almost zero chance of a new player breaking the status quo or competing fairly on a product by product basis.
aka, not capitalist.
however im more than aware that for some people capitalism means oligarchs, i just think that you should call oligarchs, oligarchs.
their are no final solutions, are no endless perfections, im not sure any of this is has ever been claimed by anyone, barring some overly keen university students muttering naive gibberish.Zack Morris wrote:Oligopolies, duopolies, and monopolies are all natural occurrences in a capitalist system (and do not require government to exist). They arise from human behavior and the constraints within which we operate. Perfect competition is not the equilibrium state for many (most?) enterprises, especially those where a high degree of differentiation exists. Capitalism is merely the system where capital is privately owned and employed with voluntary labor to produce profits that are then distributed to owners and labor according to consensual, mutual agreements. No guarantees, implied or express, about the fairness and equity of such arrangements.noddy wrote:if your not wrong then words like fascism and oligarchy and corruption dont mean anything, which is nice.
in the university economics course i did they taught us that when you only had a few players (oligopoly) or less than that (duopoly,monopoly) then its no longer a proper capitalist market and starts to behave awfully fascist/communist.
big pharma is a text book example of an oligoply of established players which have total lockin with government legislation and almost zero chance of a new player breaking the status quo or competing fairly on a product by product basis.
aka, not capitalist.
however im more than aware that for some people capitalism means oligarchs, i just think that you should call oligarchs, oligarchs.
Not really. How do you explain all the small biotech firms focusing on a particular kind of therapy? The stock market is full of them.noddy wrote: big pharma is a text book example of an oligoply of established players which have total lockin with government legislation and almost zero chance of a new player breaking the status quo or competing fairly on a product by product basis.
Fascism is much more than economic policies. And what about oligopolies/duopolies/monopolies that aren't tightly integrated with the government, like say, Google, or Microsoft in its heyday?their are no final solutions, are no endless perfections, im not sure any of this is has ever been claimed by anyone, barring some overly keen university students muttering naive gibberish.
when the market reduces to an oligopoloy/duopoly/monopoly that is tightly integrated with government via laws and dodgy dealings then its not called capitalism any more.
if the companies have the power its called oligarchy and if the government has the power its called fascism.. why do we have these words if not to differentiate from the free market state of healthy capitalism ?
We need much more deregulation rules.Simple Minded wrote:I think the solution is more regulation that everyone thinks is fair....
I tend to see fascism and nazism as system where the state is in charge and the economy, while still in private hands, is directed to certain state purposes. Capitalism, in the sense I used above, is the opposite.Zack Morris wrote:Fascism is much more than economic policies. And what about oligopolies/duopolies/monopolies that aren't tightly integrated with the government, like say, Google, or Microsoft in its heyday?
But economics is only one part of the picture. Fascism is much more than just an economic ideology. Arguably, the defining characteristics are its social values and its ideas of nationhood, individuals, and even race. Economic policy is just a means to an end for fascists, hence why it is difficult to definitively classify fascist economic views.YMix wrote:I tend to see fascism and nazism as system where the state is in charge and the economy, while still in private hands, is directed to certain state purposes. Capitalism, in the sense I used above, is the opposite.Zack Morris wrote:Fascism is much more than economic policies. And what about oligopolies/duopolies/monopolies that aren't tightly integrated with the government, like say, Google, or Microsoft in its heyday?
I posted a link to the entire article in the Oil & Gas thread, same subforum. Instead of taking Drudge's scream of "Socialism!" for granted, you should read the whole article.Simple Minded wrote:http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/b ... 1xNpbL8O_x
Socialism for thee, but not for me....
This is capitalism. Each publication published in the preferred terminology of its targeted readers.YMix wrote:
I posted a link to the entire article in the Oil & Gas thread, same subforum. Instead of taking Drudge's scream of "Socialism!" for granted, you should read the whole article.
Funny how Gates says "the market can't save us", the Independent changed that to "capitalism can't save us" and Drudge turned it into "Only Socialism Can Save Planet...". I'm waiting for complaints about the dastardly non-mainstream media?
Anyone up for some extra-terrestrial anthropomorphizing.....Parodite wrote:I agree. Milky Way Federation should fairly tax and redistribute gravity field distribution and time dilation so all can enjoy moment at same time!
You're just a shill for Big Gravity.Parodite wrote:I agree. Milky Way Federation should fairly tax and redistribute gravity field distribution and time dilation so all can enjoy moment at same time!
Resistance is futile...BG is our destiny.YMix wrote:You're just a shill for Big Gravity.Parodite wrote:I agree. Milky Way Federation should fairly tax and redistribute gravity field distribution and time dilation so all can enjoy moment at same time!
You bet! Operation Space-Burger in a graph:Simple Minded wrote:Anyone up for some extra-terrestrial anthropomorphizing.....Parodite wrote:I agree. Milky Way Federation should fairly tax and redistribute gravity field distribution and time dilation so all can enjoy moment at same time!
So, you finally reveal yourself as a reptilian sympathizer. I knew you couldn't hide it forever, assuming space-time continuum is constant.....
You know the existence of the Milky Way Federation is just a myth invented by the Joos, right?
This picture is racist!Parodite wrote:Resistance is futile...BG is our destiny.YMix wrote:You're just a shill for Big Gravity.Parodite wrote:I agree. Milky Way Federation should fairly tax and redistribute gravity field distribution and time dilation so all can enjoy moment at same time!
True, but on the whole, he is doing a much better job than most would expect a pure bred human or arachnoid to do.Parodite wrote:I suspect spider man is behind everything.