The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

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kmich
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by kmich »

Wasn't much point in my posting the Dreher article either. Sorry about that.
noddy
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by noddy »

kmich wrote:Wasn't much point in my posting the Dreher article either. Sorry about that.
do you have your own ideas on it ?

to me the contradiction between the proposed problem and the suggested response being identical was overwhelming.

i liked having read it in the sense i would not have sourced that material out myself, so dont feel inclined to stop because several of us didnt agree.
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kmich
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

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noddy wrote:
kmich wrote:Wasn't much point in my posting the Dreher article either. Sorry about that.
do you have your own ideas on it ?

to me the contradiction between the proposed problem and the suggested response being identical was overwhelmingly g.

i liked having read it in the sense i would not have sourced that material out myself, so dont feel inclined to stop because several of us didnt agree.
Well to answer your criticism, turning to devote ones energies to your own community in response to an absence of political solutions can be reactive, negative, and insular, but can also be a positive, faithful, way of rebuilding a life and a culture from the ground up when political solutions to the decay of the public square beyond the local are no longer doable. Dreher is suggesting the latter, not the former.

The engagement with other communities is essential, but not practical until ones own community and local institutions are properly supported. Building lives, cultures, and institutions locally can become the only practical way to build the foundation for national renewal when the national political culture has been corrupted beyond any viable political solution.

Now, none of that strikes me as "ivory tower elitist," "pink underwear liberal" (Mr P wears only boxers, you see ;) ), or at all "flakey" to me, but I know I can be an oddball here.
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NapLajoieonSteroids
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by NapLajoieonSteroids »

Mr. Perfect wrote:Trump MO very easy to understand. Drop Nuclear Bomb (politically), let liberals freak out, then people start coming around. Very effective. We may see a President in the realm of Washington, Lincoln, Reagan. Change is coming.
well, however true that is, it is driving people away that should you be in your corner.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

The GOP is so frightened of Trump they are considering a brokered convention and appointing a candidate by caucus. We may well see Trump fronting a new 'Bull Moose' party in 2016.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

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NapLajoieonSteroids
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by NapLajoieonSteroids »

Nonc Hilaire wrote:The GOP is so frightened of Trump they are considering a brokered convention and appointing a candidate by caucus. We may well see Trump fronting a new 'Bull Moose' party in 2016.
Given his crass nature, maybe this time around it will be the 'Bull Testicle' Party- it will be full of high energy, that's for sure.

The GOP dilemma turns on appointing a candidate by caucus or having Caucasians appoint a candidate! :?
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

NapLajoieonSteroids wrote:
Nonc Hilaire wrote:The GOP is so frightened of Trump they are considering a brokered convention and appointing a candidate by caucus. We may well see Trump fronting a new 'Bull Moose' party in 2016.
Given his crass nature, maybe this time around it will be the 'Bull Testicle' Party- it will be full of high energy, that's for sure.

The GOP dilemma turns on appointing a candidate by caucus or having Caucasians appoint a candidate! :?
Bullshit party, more likely :lol:
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

Teresa of Ávila
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Simple Minded »

kmich wrote:
Well to answer your criticism, turning to devote ones energies to your own community in response to an absence of political solutions can be reactive, negative, and insular, but can also be a positive, faithful, way of rebuilding a life and a culture from the ground up when political solutions to the decay of the public square beyond the local are no longer doable. Dreher is suggesting the latter, not the former.

The engagement with other communities is essential, but not practical until ones own community and local institutions are properly supported. Building lives, cultures, and institutions locally can become the only practical way to build the foundation for national renewal when the national political culture has been corrupted beyond any viable political solution.
Amen. If all the Physicians/Experts would heal/fix themselves (ie: focus only on local problems) before prescribing how their neighbors and those they have ever met who live far over the horizon should think and act, that would be a great place to live.

Hyper-simplified as if everyone swept in front of their own door, the whole world would be clean.

I think other people may have thought of this previously.....
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by noddy »

kmich wrote:
noddy wrote:
kmich wrote:Wasn't much point in my posting the Dreher article either. Sorry about that.
do you have your own ideas on it ?

to me the contradiction between the proposed problem and the suggested response being identical was overwhelmingly g.

i liked having read it in the sense i would not have sourced that material out myself, so dont feel inclined to stop because several of us didnt agree.
Well to answer your criticism, turning to devote ones energies to your own community in response to an absence of political solutions can be reactive, negative, and insular, but can also be a positive, faithful, way of rebuilding a life and a culture from the ground up when political solutions to the decay of the public square beyond the local are no longer doable. Dreher is suggesting the latter, not the former.

The engagement with other communities is essential, but not practical until ones own community and local institutions are properly supported. Building lives, cultures, and institutions locally can become the only practical way to build the foundation for national renewal when the national political culture has been corrupted beyond any viable political solution.

Now, none of that strikes me as "ivory tower elitist," "pink underwear liberal" (Mr P wears only boxers, you see ;) ), or at all "flakey" to me, but I know I can be an oddball here.
cant speak for mr p, i live in a hot country so underwear can be a burdern , nap can usually speak for himself well, so id not go there either.


for the rest, ill try and organise my thoughts a bit more coherantly and avoid my usual disjointed brain dump approach.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Simple Minded »

noddy wrote:
cant speak for mr p, i live in a hot country so underwear can be a burdern , nap can usually speak for himself well, so id not go there either.


for the rest, ill try and organise my thoughts a bit more coherantly and avoid my usual disjointed brain dump approach.
regarding your thoughts on underwear.... please consult the indifference handbook before posting.... thanks in advance. :P
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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

.

7eJpWOY3r18


:lol:


.
Mr. Perfect
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Mr. Perfect »

kmich wrote: Well to answer your criticism, turning to devote ones energies to your own community in response to an absence of political solutions can be reactive, negative, and insular, but can also be a positive, faithful, way of rebuilding a life and a culture from the ground up when political solutions to the decay of the public square beyond the local are no longer doable. Dreher is suggesting the latter, not the former.

The engagement with other communities is essential, but not practical until ones own community and local institutions are properly supported. Building lives, cultures, and institutions locally can become the only practical way to build the foundation for national renewal when the national political culture has been corrupted beyond any viable political solution.

Now, none of that strikes me as "ivory tower elitist," "pink underwear liberal" (Mr P wears only boxers, you see ;) ), or at all "flakey" to me, but I know I can be an oddball here.
The pink underwear liberal was obvious in other comments.
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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

.


The New Yorker
To Those Fleeing President Trump :
Welcome to Canada !
.. :lol: :lol:


Very nice article


Justin (Trudeau), Gooooooooooooo


.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Typhoon »

The Republicrats POTUS candidates had another debate.

Any clear winners? Losers?
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Mr. Perfect »

kmich wrote: Well to answer your criticism, turning to devote ones energies to your own community in response to an absence of political solutions can be reactive, negative, and insular, but can also be a positive, faithful, way of rebuilding a life and a culture from the ground up when political solutions to the decay of the public square beyond the local are no longer doable. Dreher is suggesting the latter, not the former.
Sorry I missed this earlier, "Think globally act locally" is an old leftist platitude everyone ignores, because it doesn't really work. It's 2015.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Doc »

Typhoon wrote:The Republicrats POTUS candidates had another debate.

Any clear winners? Losers?

Jeb Bush has a huge Debate watching party in Miami. Unfortunately for him no one came:

Image
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kmich
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by kmich »

Typhoon wrote:The Republicrats POTUS candidates had another debate.

Any clear winners? Losers?
At one point, I thought Trump was going to give Jeb a wedgie.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Typhoon »

kmich wrote:
Typhoon wrote:The Republicrats POTUS candidates had another debate.

Any clear winners? Losers?
At one point, I thought Trump was going to give Jeb a wedgie.
:lol:

Now if it was Trump and Carly giving each other wedgies, it would have been worth watching.

Final GOP 2015 debate | More of the same: a confederacy of chickensh*ts
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

.

Really sad watching the Republican candidate debate yesterday, really sad for America

Are these the best minds of America ? the best elite politicians America can present ?

Trump acting weird .. not sure he has what it takes 2B president, probably not

Really sad


We pretty much looking at President Hillary, another 8 yrs of disaster


.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Mr. Perfect »

Typhoon wrote: :lol:

Now if it was Trump and Carly giving each other wedgies, it would have been worth watching.

Final GOP 2015 debate | More of the same: a confederacy of chickensh*ts
Why post an article on something you didn't watch.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Mr. Perfect »

Heracleum Persicum wrote:.
Really sad watching the Republican candidate debate yesterday, really sad for America

Are these the best minds of America ? the best elite politicians America can present ?

Trump acting weird .. not sure he has what it takes 2B president, probably not

Really sad

We pretty much looking at President Hillary, another 8 yrs of disaster
.
Bright spot, when Hillary back in spotlight she should be looking even worse.
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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

Mr. Perfect wrote:
Heracleum Persicum wrote:.
Really sad watching the Republican candidate debate yesterday, really sad for America

Are these the best minds of America ? the best elite politicians America can present ?

Trump acting weird .. not sure he has what it takes 2B president, probably not

Really sad

We pretty much looking at President Hillary, another 8 yrs of disaster

.
Bright spot, when Hillary back in spotlight she should be looking even worse.

.

Look, Mr. Perfect .. this new age .. Kardashians as THE celebrity and Tramp the President

Oh, Lord, what happened to our beloved America ! ! !

Amen

.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by Mr. Perfect »

obama got elected. It was a big mistake.
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by noddy »

Heracleum Persicum wrote:
Mr. Perfect wrote:
Heracleum Persicum wrote:.
Really sad watching the Republican candidate debate yesterday, really sad for America

Are these the best minds of America ? the best elite politicians America can present ?

Trump acting weird .. not sure he has what it takes 2B president, probably not

Really sad

We pretty much looking at President Hillary, another 8 yrs of disaster

.
Bright spot, when Hillary back in spotlight she should be looking even worse.

.

Look, Mr. Perfect .. this new age .. Kardashians as THE celebrity and Tramp the President

Oh, Lord, what happened to our beloved America ! ! !

Amen

.

haha the west has always had floozy starlets and bumbling idiots for politicians.

the only difference now is we have voting idiots who think that the bumbling idiots should be in charge of our health and our relationships and whatnot.

that makes the bumbling idiots very dangerous.
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kmich
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Re: The eternal US elections - 2016 edition

Post by kmich »

Anger: An American History

By Stacy Schiff
WHERE, many have asked these last weeks, do the rhetorical fireballs — the raging suspicion and rabid xenophobia — come from? Barring people from our shores, Paul Ryan reminds us, is “not what this country stands for.” Emma Lazarus would have agreed. But while the demonizing may sound un-American, it happens also to be ur-American.

Well before Japanese internment camps, before the Know-Nothing Party, before the Alien and Sedition Acts, New England drew its identity from threats to public safety. We manned the nation’s watchtowers before we were even a nation.

From that earlier set of founding fathers — the men who settled 17th century Massachusetts — came the first dark words about dark powers. No matter that they sailed to these shores in search of religious freedom. Once established, they pulled up the gangplank behind them. The city on a hill was an exclusively Puritan sanctuary. The sense of exceptionalism — “we are surely the Lord’s firstborn in this wilderness,” the Massachusetts minister William Stoughton observed in an influential 1668 address — bound itself up from the start with prejudice. If you are the pure, someone else needs to be impure.

Quakers fared badly. In Boston, Cotton Mather compared them not only to dogs, but to serpents, dragons and vipers. The great young hope of the New England ministry, he sounds as if he would have started a Quaker database if he could have. Banned, exiled, imprisoned, whipped, Quakers were a “leprous” people, their teachings as wholesome as the “juice of toads.”

Baptists and Anglicans fared little better. In 1689, Boston’s Anglicans discovered the windows of their church smashed, “the doors and walls daubed and defiled with dung, and other filth, in the rudest and basest manner imaginable.” The most moderate of Massachusetts men believed in Papist cabals; priests qualified as the radical Muslim clerics of the day. From the pulpit came regular warnings that boatloads of nefarious Irishmen were set to disembark in Boston harbor, to establish Roman Catholicism in New England.

The alerts naturally served an evangelical purpose. The common enemy encouraged cohesion, appealing to a tribal instinct. In the words of Owen Stanwood, a Boston College historian, the trumped-up fears neatly packaged the Massachusetts settlers’ “desire for security, their Protestant heritage, and their nascent sense of racial privilege.” Those anxieties multiplied at a time of real violence, of political and economic dislocation, of an emboldened Native American population. And in 1690, Mather warned, New England was in a state of “such distress and danger as it never saw before.” He forecast the imminent descent of “whole armies of Indians and Gallic bloodhounds.”

The muddled fears produced a snarl of blame. When fire broke out in 1679 Boston, it was said to be the work of Baptists. Who killed the sheep grazing on Cambridge Common? It had been wolves, but it made sense to harass Frenchmen anyway. The enemies did not need actually to be in New England’s midst. As an Anglican official snorted from a Boston prison in 1689: “There were not two Roman Catholics betwixt this and New York.” New England was nonetheless sacrificed over and over to its heathen adversaries, according to the ministry, that era’s Department of Homeland Security.

In the blur of rampaging predators it became increasingly difficult to distinguish Indians from Frenchmen from devils. One village minister lumped together Louis XIV, his Catholic confederates and Satan, at least two of whom were nowhere in the neighborhood. Conspiratorial fantasies came easily to a Puritan, who found them enthusiastically confirmed from the pulpit, the sole means of mass communication in a province still without newspapers.

Nor, when it came to subversive forces, was it necessary to conjure up real ones. In 1692, New Englanders began to look among themselves for things they could not see. To the “bloody and barbarous heathens,” as Stoughton would term the French, New England added invisible demons, producing the panic we now know as the Salem witch trials.

So great was the terror that year that grown men watched neighbors fly through the streets; they kicked at gleaming balls of fire in their beds. They saw hundreds celebrate a satanic Sabbath as clearly as some of us saw thousands of Muslims dancing in the Jersey City streets after 9/11. Stoughton would preside over the witchcraft trials, securing a 100 percent conviction rate. A Baptist minister who objected that the court risked executing innocents found himself charged with sedition. He was offered the choice between a jail sentence and a crushing fine. He was not heard from again. One problem with decency: It can be maddeningly quiet, at least until it explodes and asks if anyone has noticed it has been sitting, squirming, in the room all along.

The toxic brush fires flare up with regularity. “Shall our sons become the disciples of Voltaire, and the dragoons of Marat; or our daughters the concubines of the Illuminati?” asked Yale’s president on July 4, 1798. In the 1830s it was the Mormons’ turn to subvert America. The language remains remarkably consistent: A 1799 pro-Federalist sermon warned of a plot to “subvert and overturn our holy religion and our free and excellent government.” In 1951 the judge sentencing the Rosenbergs for espionage termed theirs a “diabolical conspiracy to destroy a God-fearing nation.” Throughout, we brandish our enemies’ hatred as our badge of honor. The churning suspicions invigorate; we become superheroes when we bulk up our opponents. To rage against the powers of darkness is to assure ourselves that we stand in the light.

The homegrown history in no way justifies the incendiary language. But it reminds us that the demonic plots are unlikely to vanish anytime soon. Anxiety produces specters; sensing ourselves lost, disenfranchised, dwarfed, we take reckless aim. “We have to be much smarter, or it’s never, ever going to end,” Donald J. Trump has warned of the war on terror. Amen. At least we can savor the irony that today’s zealots share a playbook with the Puritans, a people who — finding the holiday too pagan — waged the original war on Christmas.
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