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AzariLoveIran

U$

Post by AzariLoveIran »

.

Sheikhs fall in love with renminbi


.

Sheikhs fall in love with renminbi

By M K Bhadrakumar

China and Qatar have been taking virtually opposite positions apropos events in Libya and Syria. Yet, they do not seem to be deterred by this little difference and are bonding in a big way in economic cooperation to mutual benefit.

Chinese Prime Minister Wen Jiabao, who visited Doha last week, disclosed at a press conference on Friday: a) China proposes to invest in the manufacturing of ''downstream oil products, which are most urgently needed by Qatar''; b) China and Qatar signed an agreement to jointly build a refinery in Taizhou, Zheijiang, in China; c) Chinese companies propose to participate in infrastructure projects in Qatar; and d) China and Qatar are discussing a "long-term, stable and comprehensive cooperative partnership" in natural gas.

Then, Wen quietly dropped a bombshell. He revealed "one more important point" as if it were an afterthought. He said:

In order to address investment issues, we [China and Qatar] need financial support. Therefore, we reached another agreement, a cooperation agreement linking finance with investment. Qatar also proposed the use of local currency in trade settlement and even a specific ratio. I think this proposal can be studied.

The short point is, the renminbi, the "people's currency" also known as the yuan, is appearing in Doha. The China-United Arab Emirates (UAE) currency swap deal which was signed during Wen's visit to Abu Dhabi last week already brings the yuan to the Emirates. The deal with the UAE is worth US$5.5 billion and the Chinese central bank statement said that it aims at "strengthening bilateral financial cooperation, promoting trade and investments and jointly safeguarding regional financial stability".

Indeed, China is playing for the long term. Addressing an energy summit in the UAE, Wen made the startling proposal to create an international body that is mandated to determine the price of oil and which would regulate the policies of the entire supply chain involving the supplier countries, the consumers and even the transit countries.

Iran and Russia have already switched to their national currencies for conducting bilateral trade. Tehran's ambassador to Moscow Seyed Reza Sajjadi said on Friday, "[Trade] with Russia is based on our national currencies. We started this work long ago. Iranian businessmen are buying products in Russia and are using the rouble as [payment] currency] ... The US dollar has no [economic] support base ... There is a similar interest on the Russian side."

Last week, it also came to be known that India proposes to allow Iran's central bank to open rupee accounts with two Indian banks as a long-term solution to the countries' payment problems instigated by the US (which pressured New Delhi to terminate the traditional payment mechanism for Iran within the Asian Clearing Union.) An Indian delegation visited Tehran last week to finalize details.

The new arrangement envisages that while the payments for India's oil imports from Iran (roughly $12-14 billion annually) would be initially in Indian rupees, they would subsequently be converted into a separate designated currency. This is a pointed snub to Washington, which forbids friendly countries from dealings with Iran's central bank.

But, the UAE and Qatar are not to be compared with Russia or India. They are widely regarded as the anchor sheets of the Western strategy in the Middle East and they provide very substantial underpinnings to the petrodollar recycling.

Aren't we missing something here? Quite obviously, Persian Gulf countries are slowly, steadily probing their options in the Asia-Pacific to diversify their external relations that have been traditionally riveted to the West. With Europe in serious disarray and the US in decline and its reputation in the Middle East significantly dented, this trend is likely to become pronounced.

Smells like Arabic coffee ...
Equally, Wen made some candid remarks on Syria and Iran during his press conference in Doha, fully realizing that his host country would have a different point of view. Wen said Beijing is "very concerned" about the Syrian situation. He added in some detail:

Syria's turmoil has been going on for quite some time. We have three comments on the Syria issue. First, we need to strive to seek a peaceful and political solution to the Syria issue. We oppose the killing of innocent civilians and should prevent it from happening. The order in Syria should be restored as early as possible.

Second, we must respect the requests of the Syrian people for change and their demands to safeguard their own interests. Third, we need to give play to the LAS' [Arab League's] role in this regard, especially its investigation and mediation role on the Syria issue, and enable LAS to provide help for the peaceful resolution of the Syria issue through dialogues and by political means.

Our goal is to find solutions, including meeting the requests of the people for change, continuing to develop economy and improving people's livelihood, so that states experiencing instability such as Syria could achieve stability and development.

This is the first major policy pronouncement on Syria by the Chinese leadership and, most interestingly, it was made on Qatari soil. The impression one gets increasingly is that China is quite comfortable with both Iran and the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) states and doesn't see the security paradigm in the Persian Gulf in quite those zero-sum terms. The GCC comprises Bahrain, Kuwait, Oman, Qatar, Saudi Arabia and the UAE.)

Again, we are blithely making assumptions on the basis of the sustained Western propaganda regarding an impassable Sunni-Shi'ite schism in the Persian Gulf, which completely overlooks that Iran and the GCC states (Saudi Arabia, in particular) have always maintained back channels to keep their discords in check.

Evidently, China is placing itself in the middle of the divide in the Persian Gulf while strengthening its interests on both sides. How its newfound influence plays out will be interesting to watch.

In turn, the GCC states also do not seem to mind that China has a strong strategic partnership with Iran. And, on its part, China seems justified in assessing that the GCC rulers are far from the one-dimensional moronic anti-Shi'ite fanatics that Western propaganda often makes them out to be. Beijing's new thinking opens up a fantastic panorama of China-GCC cooperation.

Wen said Iran didn't figure in his conversations with the leaderships in Saudi Arabia, the UAE or Qatar.

The Chinese commentaries have made it out to be that continued Iranian oil supplies are vital for China and implying that any increased purchases from Big Oil operating out of the GCC states would make China vulnerable to pressures. The government-owned China Daily featured a commentary on Saturday in a wrap-up of Wen's tour of the Persian Gulf, which said:

US is lobbying the international community to put the screws on Iran. But China should read into this game and refrain from succumbing under other big powers' pressure ... China should follow its own course, for Sino-Iranian trade is in accordance with international laws ...

Iran is an essential overseas market for goods, especially technology-intensive ones, from China, which built the subway in Tehran ... Oil imports from Iran are very important for China. If China stops importing oil from Iran, it will face an immediate shortage of fuel. Even if China can meet the shortage by importing from other countries, it would have to pay high prices and meet harsh conditions, which will deal a terrible blow to its economy. China has long suffered the whims of big oil-exporting companies and it is time their monopoly was curbed.

Wen was plainly dismissive about Western media reports that he was scouting for GCC oil to replace Iranian oil. "Some people think I have come for the oil. I think they are too narrow-minded. It should be said that I have come for the friendship. The biggest harvest of my trip is the enhanced mutual political trust."

Thus, a new matrix is shaping up whereby within the framework of bilateral agreements, Persian Gulf countries - Iran and the GCC alike - are beginning to bypass the US dollar as an intermediary in their oil trade with Asia.

Neither the UAE nor Qatar is embarking on a strategic defiance of the US. But they know that the yuan smells like good Arabic coffee and it feels great to hold it in a volatile and ephemeral world, given that its appreciation in value in the future is a certainty.

Simply put, the UAE and Qatar are creating a cushion from exchange rate volatility. But the geopolitical reality is also that the renminbi will look great sitting in their vaults. The big question is when Saudi Arabia might make its move.

.

look folks , world oil production is 88 m b/d .. Oil buyers must buy (88 m x 100 $/b) 8.8 Billion Dollars a day to pay for that oil

If, only, half of that oil is not paid by Dollars, but by "renminbi" and "Ruble" and "Indian rupee" and Canadian Dollars etc etc

if so

Dollar will drop at least (another) 50%

already happening


.
AzariLoveIran

Re: U$

Post by AzariLoveIran »

.

India to pay gold instead of dollars for Iranian oil .. China to follow suit

Iran could peg Iranian currency to Gold :lol: :D :)

and

pay for everything with gold

well folks .. that is called "Unintended Consequences"

.
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Carbizene
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Re: U$

Post by Carbizene »

Exciting times for supporters of Global diversity, the rise of gold makes for true diversity.
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monster_gardener
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Re: U$

Post by monster_gardener »

AzariLoveIran wrote:.

India to pay gold instead of dollars for Iranian oil .. China to follow suit

Iran could peg Iranian currency to Gold :lol: :D :)

and

pay for everything with gold

well folks .. that is called "Unintended Consequences"

.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

Interesting...........

Suspect Ron Paul would approve...........

Could be interesting to see how this works out...........

Is Iran going to start backing its money with gold or issue gold coins?
For the love of G_d, consider you & I may be mistaken.
Orion Must Rise: Killer Space Rocks Coming Our way
The Best Laid Plans of Men, Monkeys & Pigs Oft Go Awry
Woe to those who long for the Day of the Lord, for It is Darkness, Not Light
AzariLoveIran

Re: U$

Post by AzariLoveIran »

.

Shah did not want to accept Dollars for Oil .. he was proposing a basket of goods for Oil .. Iranians think that is the reason West overthrow Shah

Qaddafi was preparing for all Africa to accept ONLY "Gold Dinar" for African resources

Persian Golf Amirates already talking with China to take renminbi for Oil

Iran will take only Gold for Oil

Russia, a major Oil (and Gold) producer "could" revert to Gold currency too

well .. if all this happens , the rest will snow ball

result

Dollar will collapse .. British Pound will collapse .. Euro will prevail


:D

monster_gardener wrote:
AzariLoveIran wrote:.

India to pay gold instead of dollars for Iranian oil .. China to follow suit

Iran could peg Iranian currency to Gold :lol: :D :)

and

pay for everything with gold

well folks .. that is called "Unintended Consequences"

.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

Interesting...........

Suspect Ron Paul would approve...........

Could be interesting to see how this works out...........

Is Iran going to start backing its money with gold or issue gold coins?

.

mad mullahs, the ruling faction now, are ultra conservative

My guess is , first they will peg to Gold .. having Gold clearing house in Tehran, Moscow, Beijing, India and maybe Singapore, Malaysia, Brazil

Western financial system is fake, phony, empty .. Oil is a precious commodity, can not be exchanged (sold) for paper

Gold is the way to go

Saddam wanted to do this, Qaddafi wanted to this .. Now Iranians will implement it

.
User avatar
monster_gardener
Posts: 5334
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:36 am
Location: Trolla. Land of upside down trees and tomatos........

Re: U$

Post by monster_gardener »

AzariLoveIran wrote:.

Shah did not want to accept Dollars for Oil .. he was proposing a basket of goods for Oil .. Iranians think that is the reason West overthrow Shah

Qaddafi was preparing for all Africa to accept ONLY "Gold Dinar" for African resources

Persian Golf Amirates already talking with China to take renminbi for Oil

Iran will take only Gold for Oil

Russia, a major Oil (and Gold) producer "could" revert to Gold currency too

well .. if all this happens , the rest will snow ball

result

Dollar will collapse .. British Pound will collapse .. Euro will prevail


:D

monster_gardener wrote:
AzariLoveIran wrote:.

India to pay gold instead of dollars for Iranian oil .. China to follow suit

Iran could peg Iranian currency to Gold :lol: :D :)

and

pay for everything with gold

well folks .. that is called "Unintended Consequences"

.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

Interesting...........

Suspect Ron Paul would approve...........

Could be interesting to see how this works out...........

Is Iran going to start backing its money with gold or issue gold coins?

.

mad mullahs, the ruling faction now, are ultra conservative

My guess is , first they will peg to Gold .. having Gold clearing house in Tehran, Moscow, Beijing, India and maybe Singapore, Malaysia, Brazil

Western financial system is fake, phony, empty .. Oil is a precious commodity, can not be exchanged (sold) for paper

Gold is the way to go

Saddam wanted to do this, Qaddafi wanted to this .. Now Iranians will implement it

.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

Interesting............

How much gold equals the value of a barrel of oil?

Would Iran be taking physical possession of the gold or just having gold bricks moved to it's pile at a reserve bank AIUI it is done here......

Advantages and disadvantages to each method: danger of theft by Government vs. theft by pirates, storms (talk to the Spanish) ............


IMHO Gold is better than paper but a basket of commodities sounds even better......... Gold has some intrinsic value but is hard to eat*

What did the Shah have in mind?


* Remember a story from the Arabian Nights........ Famine strikes an Island state........ Last inhabitant a preserved Queen..........
For the love of G_d, consider you & I may be mistaken.
Orion Must Rise: Killer Space Rocks Coming Our way
The Best Laid Plans of Men, Monkeys & Pigs Oft Go Awry
Woe to those who long for the Day of the Lord, for It is Darkness, Not Light
AzariLoveIran

Re: U$

Post by AzariLoveIran »

monster_gardener wrote:
AzariLoveIran wrote:.

Shah did not want to accept Dollars for Oil .. he was proposing a basket of goods for Oil .. Iranians think that is the reason West overthrow Shah

Qaddafi was preparing for all Africa to accept ONLY "Gold Dinar" for African resources

Persian Golf Amirates already talking with China to take renminbi for Oil

Iran will take only Gold for Oil

Russia, a major Oil (and Gold) producer "could" revert to Gold currency too

well .. if all this happens , the rest will snow ball

result

Dollar will collapse .. British Pound will collapse .. Euro will prevail


:D

monster_gardener wrote:
AzariLoveIran wrote:.

India to pay gold instead of dollars for Iranian oil .. China to follow suit

Iran could peg Iranian currency to Gold :lol: :D :)

and

pay for everything with gold

well folks .. that is called "Unintended Consequences"

.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

Interesting...........

Suspect Ron Paul would approve...........

Could be interesting to see how this works out...........

Is Iran going to start backing its money with gold or issue gold coins?

.

mad mullahs, the ruling faction now, are ultra conservative

My guess is , first they will peg to Gold .. having Gold clearing house in Tehran, Moscow, Beijing, India and maybe Singapore, Malaysia, Brazil

Western financial system is fake, phony, empty .. Oil is a precious commodity, can not be exchanged (sold) for paper

Gold is the way to go

Saddam wanted to do this, Qaddafi wanted to this .. Now Iranians will implement it

.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

Interesting............

How much gold equals the value of a barrel of oil?

Would Iran be taking physical possession of the gold or just having gold bricks moved to it's pile at a reserve bank AIUI it is done here......

Advantages and disadvantages to each method: danger of theft by Government vs. theft by pirates, storms (talk to the Spanish) ............


IMHO Gold is better than paper but a basket of commodities sounds even better......... Gold has some intrinsic value but is hard to eat*

What did the Shah have in mind?


* Remember a story from the Arabian Nights........ Famine strikes an Island state........ Last inhabitant a preserved Queen.........

.

These days, Oil cost 100 $/b and Gold 1,665 $/Onz = would make an Oil price of 0.061 "Onz of Gold"/ b

1978 Iranian Oil concession with Oil major had 2B renewed .. 1973 Shah gave a speech to Iranians, on Iranian TV, and declared Iran is NOT going to renew the Oil contracts (video clip in youtube, but in farsi)

Shah was a nationalist .. at the beginning of his rule, he did not have the power to confront Western colonial ambitions .. but later, say 1973 onwards, he felt Iran strong enough to confront west

Sounds unbelievable to untrained eye, but all policy now mad mullahs following are a continuation of Shah's policy and what he had in mind .. Shah & Mullah differ only in cultural domain, that is why Iranian revolution is a "cultural revolution"


vGY3mqCvUtA


Gold, like Dollar now cleared by FED, will be cleared by "Central Banks" of partner states .. same as now Dollar is cleared by FED for all central banks .. any purchase will be "CLEARED" (paid) by Gold .. the exporter of any product to Iran can sell the gold back to the "clearing" central bank to daily prevailing Gold price in any currency they want, practically "priced in Gold but paid in any currency you prefer"

This will take the inflation out of Iran .. and .. if it works .. all natural resource countries will follow .. dollar will be wiped out

My guess is, and I have said this many times on foras .. down the road .. USG will legislate 2 kinds of Dollars

- Dollars in US , held by US citizens - called internal Dollars
- Dollars outside US held by foreigners, states or private - called external Dollars

those external dollars can not buy this and that and different rules apply

this not a new idea or concept, was done in Europe for many years


.
User avatar
monster_gardener
Posts: 5334
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:36 am
Location: Trolla. Land of upside down trees and tomatos........

Re: U$

Post by monster_gardener »

AzariLoveIran wrote:
monster_gardener wrote:
AzariLoveIran wrote:.

Shah did not want to accept Dollars for Oil .. he was proposing a basket of goods for Oil .. Iranians think that is the reason West overthrow Shah

Qaddafi was preparing for all Africa to accept ONLY "Gold Dinar" for African resources

Persian Golf Amirates already talking with China to take renminbi for Oil

Iran will take only Gold for Oil

Russia, a major Oil (and Gold) producer "could" revert to Gold currency too

well .. if all this happens , the rest will snow ball

result

Dollar will collapse .. British Pound will collapse .. Euro will prevail


:D

monster_gardener wrote:
AzariLoveIran wrote:.

India to pay gold instead of dollars for Iranian oil .. China to follow suit

Iran could peg Iranian currency to Gold :lol: :D :)

and

pay for everything with gold

well folks .. that is called "Unintended Consequences"

.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

Interesting...........

Suspect Ron Paul would approve...........

Could be interesting to see how this works out...........

Is Iran going to start backing its money with gold or issue gold coins?

.

mad mullahs, the ruling faction now, are ultra conservative

My guess is , first they will peg to Gold .. having Gold clearing house in Tehran, Moscow, Beijing, India and maybe Singapore, Malaysia, Brazil

Western financial system is fake, phony, empty .. Oil is a precious commodity, can not be exchanged (sold) for paper

Gold is the way to go

Saddam wanted to do this, Qaddafi wanted to this .. Now Iranians will implement it

.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

Interesting............

How much gold equals the value of a barrel of oil?

Would Iran be taking physical possession of the gold or just having gold bricks moved to it's pile at a reserve bank AIUI it is done here......

Advantages and disadvantages to each method: danger of theft by Government vs. theft by pirates, storms (talk to the Spanish) ............


IMHO Gold is better than paper but a basket of commodities sounds even better......... Gold has some intrinsic value but is hard to eat*

What did the Shah have in mind?


* Remember a story from the Arabian Nights........ Famine strikes an Island state........ Last inhabitant a preserved Queen.........

.

These days, Oil cost 100 $/b and Gold 1,665 $/Onz = would make an Oil price of 0.061 "Onz of Gold"/ b

1978 Iranian Oil concession with Oil major had 2B renewed .. 1973 Shah gave a speech to Iranians, on Iranian TV, and declared Iran is NOT going to renew the Oil contracts (video clip in youtube, but in farsi)

Shah was a nationalist .. at the beginning of his rule, he did not have the power to confront Western colonial ambitions .. but later, say 1973 onwards, he felt Iran strong enough to confront west

Soundable s unbelievto untrained eye, but all policy now mad mullahs following are a continuation of Shah's policy and what he had in mind .. Shah & Mullah differ only in cultural domain, that is why Iranian revolution is a "cultural revolution"


vGY3mqCvUtA


Gold, like Dollar now cleared by FED, will be cleared by "Central Banks" of partner states .. same as now Dollar is cleared by FED for all central banks .. any purchase will be "CLEARED" (paid) by Gold .. the exporter of any product to Iran can sell the gold back to the "clearing" central bank to daily prevailing Gold price in any currency they want, practically "priced in Gold but paid in any currency you prefer"

This will take the inflation out of Iran .. and .. if it works .. all natural resource countries will follow .. dollar will be wiped out

My guess is, and I have said this many times on foras .. down the road .. USG will legislate 2 kinds of Dollars

- Dollars in US , held by US citizens - called internal Dollars
- Dollars outside US held by foreigners, states or private - called external Dollars

those external dollars can not buy this and that and different rules apply

this not a new idea or concept, was done in Europe for many years


.

Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.

And the calculations............ interesting...............

You may be right about the future of the dollar...........

And not just the dollar: AIUI ANY fiat fractional reserve currency............. (Tell me if I am wrong, Mr. Perfect or anybody else)............

Not sure why you say Euro will prevail though.........

http://wealthcycles.com/blog/2011/01/20 ... ed-by-gold

Scary..................

You sound like Ron Paul............. Whom I support..............

Ron Paul want's the US to go on the gold standard........

IMVVHO This has the potential to force that.............

Wonder what the Banksters will do to prevent that............ Maybe even more scary.................
Soundable s unbelievto untrained eye, but all policy now mad mullahs following are a continuation of Shah's policy and what he had in mind .. Shah & Mullah differ only in cultural domain, that is why Iranian revolution is a "cultural revolution"

IMVVHO not so much............

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80 ... 1948-79.29

Under the Shah, Israel and Iran were working on a joint nuke capable missile project using American tech..........

Wonder if Cincinnatus was referring to Iran as well as China..........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Flower

IMVHO I see the US/Iran/Israel conflict as being to a large degree being a Muslim meme thing...............

Would like to think that if Iran dumped the mad mullahs ................. peace could prevail........

But this gold thing is worrisome.................

Not saying Iran is wrong to want hard currency but with the other tensions, this could be another straw on the camel, maybe even a log :(

I DON'T trust the Banksters here or overseas.................


The Shah's speech was also interesting especially about the price of wheat...........

Was watching a program about wheat: mentioned that some sort of awful wheat rust which started in Ethiopia was devastating Iran and heading for Pakistan............ Just what the World does not need........... hunger..........

Throw/Put another log on the Camel............. :(

oOCC1EKXRBc

Link is from 2010. Wonder if it was part of the Arab Spring.........

http://www.irinnews.org/report.aspx?reportid=88340

In any case my sympathies: was doing aphid control and descaling on some of the plants yesterday and today......
For the love of G_d, consider you & I may be mistaken.
Orion Must Rise: Killer Space Rocks Coming Our way
The Best Laid Plans of Men, Monkeys & Pigs Oft Go Awry
Woe to those who long for the Day of the Lord, for It is Darkness, Not Light
AzariLoveIran

Re: U$

Post by AzariLoveIran »

monster_gardener wrote:.

IMVHO I see the US/Iran/Israel conflict as being to a large degree being a Muslim meme thing ...............

Would like to think that if Iran dumped the mad mullahs ................. peace could prevail ........

.
Iran and Iranians were very helpful for establishment of Israel .. and .. Iranians have nothing against Israel and a good friend of Jews since 1000s of year, Jews and specially Iranians Jews love Iran and Iranians.

Issue is geopolitical .. Iran hegemony over that space would mean Saudi/Israel would become 2nd class .. but .. both, Israel and Arabia mistaken .. Iranian rise means rise of Middle East people, culture and civilization

No, this not only Mullah issue .. Iranian nation is rising up, not mad mullahs .. If Shah in power, similar situation would exist

monster_gardener wrote:.

But this gold thing is worrisome .................

Not saying Iran is wrong to want hard currency but with the other tensions, this could be another straw on the camel, maybe even a log :(

I DON'T trust the Banksters here or overseas.................

The Shah's speech was also interesting especially about the price of wheat ...........

.

Inflation is the tool for the smart-ass to ride the donkey (Joe) .. key tool for Wall Street to genuflect Joe

With Gold currency, you must work for living

Rhubarb hates it, "Why are Gentiles needed? They will work, they will plow, they will reap. We will sit like an effendi and eat.


:lol:


.
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monster_gardener
Posts: 5334
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:36 am
Location: Trolla. Land of upside down trees and tomatos........

Re: U$

Post by monster_gardener »

AzariLoveIran wrote:
monster_gardener wrote:.

IMVHO I see the US/Iran/Israel conflict as being to a large degree being a Muslim meme thing ...............

Would like to think that if Iran dumped the mad mullahs ................. peace could prevail ........

.
Iran and Iranians were very helpful for establishment of Israel .. and .. Iranians have nothing against Israel and a good friend of Jews since 1000s of year, Jews and specially Iranians Jews love Iran and Iranians.

Issue is geopolitical .. Iran hegemony over that space would mean Saudi/Israel would become 2nd class .. but .. both, Israel and Arabia mistaken .. Iranian rise means rise of Middle East people, culture and civilization

No, this not only Mullah issue .. Iranian nation is rising up, not mad mullahs .. If Shah in power, similar situation would exist

monster_gardener wrote:.

But this gold thing is worrisome .................

Not saying Iran is wrong to want hard currency but with the other tensions, this could be another straw on the camel, maybe even a log :(

I DON'T trust the Banksters here or overseas.................

The Shah's speech was also interesting especially about the price of wheat ...........

.

Inflation is the tool for the smart-ass to ride the donkey (Joe) .. key tool for Wall Street to genuflect Joe

With Gold currency, you must work for living

Rhubarb hates it, "Why are Gentiles needed? They will work, they will plow, they will reap. We will sit like an effendi and eat.


:lol:


.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.
Issue is geopolitical .. Iran hegemony over that space would mean Saudi/Israel would become 2nd class .. but .. both,
If Iran's aims are per the map, I don't see the Israel - Iran conflict.......... AIUI neither did the Shah............

The Saudis do need to worry though......... Just AIUI they did with the Shah.........

With Gold currency, you must work for living
Maybe............. Even Ron Paul has some caveats about gold..............

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_ ... al_Reserve

In the 19th Century, the Bankers/Banksters were in favor of gold........ did not want to allow silver even though constitutional.......... It was the workers and especially the farmers who wanted silver or greenbacks..........

AND hot off the press Newt Gingrinch supports it! :wink:

http://business.financialpost.com/2012/ ... o-reality/

I sometimes think a basket of commodities MIGHT be better: bushels of wheat, cans of beans, ammunition (lead based currency :wink:), Cipro pills, maybe even barrels of oil :wink: or the energy equivalent.........

I'm a plant wizard :wink: among other things but not IMVVHO a financial one, so will listen to those who are wiser unless it obviously stinks (TARP etc, Hannity sometimes...... right now for instance.) ..........


[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ovadia_Yosef


Thanks for the link...... Not something I or even other sane Jews like/would to hear (Asimov or Feynmann IMVHO were they still with US :( ) ......... Have scanned and Yosef seems to be quite a contradiction*: Advocates killing Arabs but pressures Shamir to make peace with them.......... Good to know he is out there........... ........ Need to read further...... Thanks again............

*Perhaps he is working on as weird as I am :wink:


EDIT: Note to self: slow down on snarky on Hannity: was being a jerk at beginning of program........... by end he was praising Rand though not so much Ron Paul :o :shock:
Last edited by monster_gardener on Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
For the love of G_d, consider you & I may be mistaken.
Orion Must Rise: Killer Space Rocks Coming Our way
The Best Laid Plans of Men, Monkeys & Pigs Oft Go Awry
Woe to those who long for the Day of the Lord, for It is Darkness, Not Light
AzariLoveIran

Re: U$

Post by AzariLoveIran »

monster_gardener wrote:.
AzariLoveIran wrote:.

Issue is geopolitical .. Iran hegemony over that space would mean Saudi/Israel would become 2nd class .. but .. both,

.
If Iran's aims are per the map, I don't see the Israel - Iran conflict .......... AIUI neither did the Shah............

The Saudis do need to worry though......... Just AIUI they did with the Shah .........

.

Israel antagonism with Iran comes from misconception that Iran is somehow holding back (arming) Pali from being fucked (pressured) to sign on the dotted line (surrender to Russian and European converts)

but

Reality is.. Pali, Abbas, Hammas, Arafat .. they all no friend of Iran people nor Iran .. When Saddam attacked Iran, Arafat was 1st in Baghdad shaking Saddam hand and Hammas a "Wahhabi" dog

Arabia, KSA, foolishly, thinks, can, somehow (don't know how), compete, in any discipline, with Iran

How many Saudi scientist are in high American industry or scientific position ? NON

Is head of NASA Mars project Saudi ? or many NASA departmental head Saudi ?

No , they Iranian

for Arabia, there is 2 road ahead .. Join Iran into building the "New Middle East" .. or be left out and fade out

yes, a basket of goods better than Gold .. that is what Shah wanted and probably be the next stage as it would be more complicated, Gold is straight forward


.
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Post by monster_gardener »

Thanks again for your replies, Azari.

This is probably off topic for here......... Could fit better in the Iran thread as it deals with when Persia controlled Palestine/Eretz Israel and both the Phillies ;) and the Izzies ;) were still there...... and ruled more or less by the Pomegranates..................

But am remembering a book you might like:

Has a heroic Persian hero: Bessas of Zarispa............ An honorable rough and Rustam :wink: guy but don't get near him in battle if you are an enemy..........

Seriously........... something you might enjoy reading................

http://www.amazon.com/dragon-Ishtar-Gat ... 216&sr=1-1

Less expensive edition that I read years ago...........

http://www.amazon.com/DRAGON-ISHTAR-GAT ... 216&sr=1-3

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dragon ... shtar_Gate

Best Regards,
Your Friend
MG
For the love of G_d, consider you & I may be mistaken.
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Re: U$

Post by AzariLoveIran »

monster_gardener wrote:.

But this gold thing is worrisome .................

.


The real "international community" is now very much aware that India will start paying Iranian oil with gold - and not only rupees. Beijing - which already trades with Iran in yuan - may also turn to gold. Talk about the Year of the Dragon starting with a bang. And talk about the new Year of the Dragon gold standard


.

Join the oil-for-gold program

BRICS members India and China, together, buy at least 40% of Iran's oil exports, roughly 1 million barrels a day. That's 12% of India's oil needs. As for China, last year it bought 30% more oil from Iran than in 2010, an average of 557,000 barrels a day.

The real "international community" is now very much aware that India will start paying Iranian oil with gold - and not only rupees, via Indian state bank UCO and Turkish state bank Halk Bankasi. Beijing - which already trades with Iran in yuan - may also turn to gold. Needless to say, both Delhi and Beijing are major gold producers and holders of gold assets.

Talk about the Year of the Dragon starting with a bang. And talk about the new Year of the Dragon gold standard.

Everyone remembers the doomed United Nations oil-for-food program that starved Iraqis to death for years prior to the 2003 US invasion/occupation. Average Iraqis paid the terrible price for UN/US sanctions, and oil-for-food only benefited the Saddam Hussein system.

Now it's a much more serious business; the oil-for-gold program, a BRICS + Iran initiative that will benefit the Islamic Republic leadership and perhaps alleviate the effects of sanctions over the Iranian population. Global consequences: gold shooting up, petrodollar going down, oil traders opening bottles of Moet in droves.

Another BRICS member, Russia, is already trading with Iran in rials and roubles. And an aspiring BRICS member, Turkey - also a NATO member - will not follow the US/EU sanctions unless they are imposed by the UN Security Council (a no-no, because permanent members Russia and China would veto it).

In two months, Prime Minister Vladimir Putin - who angers/terrifies Washington and Brussels to Vlad the Impaler levels - is certain to be back as president of Russia. That's when the Atlanticist poodles will see real hardball at play.

Meanwhile, Tehran will never bow down to Western sanctions - much less with multiple lateral/underground mechanisms to sell its oil involving three BRICS members plus US allies Japan and South Korea, which eventually will get exemptions from the Obama administration.

As this never was about a non-existent nuclear weapon, the Tehran leadership only has to follow a supreme strategic parameter; don't fall for any provocation or false flag black ops that would provide the casus belli for a US/British/Israel axis of war attack.

And all this while trends in the - overcast - horizon point to what could be dubbed an Asian Dollar Exclusion Zone, which for many sharp minds in the developing world might pave the way for an energy-backed currency used by the BRICS and the Group of 77 (G-77) to counter the increasingly desperate - and clueless - Atlanticist West.

Back to the European poodle parade, one just has to examine the joint statement issued by these mediocrity monstrosities - British Prime Minister David Cameron, German Chancellor Angela Merkel and neo-Napoleonic "liberator of Libya", French President Nicolas Sarkozy.

The trio said, "We have no quarrel with the Iranian people." Iraqis heard exactly the same thing from another set of mediocrities in 2002 and 2003. Then their country was invaded, occupied and destroyed.

.

:lol: .. Sparky, anybody home ? ?

MG, done deal


.
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Re: U$

Post by monster_gardener »

AzariLoveIran wrote:
monster_gardener wrote:.

But this gold thing is worrisome .................

.


The real "international community" is now very much aware that India will start paying Iranian oil with gold - and not only rupees. Beijing - which already trades with Iran in yuan - may also turn to gold. Talk about the Year of the Dragon starting with a bang. And talk about the new Year of the Dragon gold standard

(NOTE by Monster Gardene: LINK = THE ROVING EYE All that glitters is ... oil - By Pepe Escobar)

.

Join the oil-for-gold program

BRICS members India and China, together, buy at least 40% of Iran's oil exports, roughly 1 million barrels a day. That's 12% of India's oil needs. As for China, last year it bought 30% more oil from Iran than in 2010, an average of 557,000 barrels a day.

The real "international community" is now very much aware that India will start paying Iranian oil with gold - and not only rupees, via Indian state bank UCO and Turkish state bank Halk Bankasi. Beijing - which already trades with Iran in yuan - may also turn to gold. Needless to say, both Delhi and Beijing are major gold producers and holders of gold assets.

Talk about the Year of the Dragon starting with a bang. And talk about the new Year of the Dragon gold standard.

Everyone remembers the doomed United Nations oil-for-food program that starved Iraqis to death for years prior to the 2003 US invasion/occupation. Average Iraqis paid the terrible price for UN/US sanctions, and oil-for-food only benefited the Saddam Hussein system.

Now it's a much more serious business; the oil-for-gold program, a BRICS + Iran initiative that will benefit the Islamic Republic leadership and perhaps alleviate the effects of sanctions over the Iranian population. Global consequences: gold shooting up, petrodollar going down, oil traders opening bottles of Moet in droves.

Another BRICS member, Russia, is already trading with Iran in rials and roubles. And an aspiring BRICS member, Turkey - also a NATO member - will not follow the US/EU sanctions unless they are imposed by the UN Security Council (a no-no, because permanent members Russia and China would veto it).

In two months, Prime Minister Vladimir Putin - who angers/terrifies Washington and Brussels to Vlad the Impaler levels - is certain to be back as president of Russia. That's when the Atlanticist poodles will see real hardball at play.

Meanwhile, Tehran will never bow down to Western sanctions - much less with multiple lateral/underground mechanisms to sell its oil involving three BRICS members plus US allies Japan and South Korea, which eventually will get exemptions from the Obama administration.

As this never was about a non-existent nuclear weapon, the Tehran leadership only has to follow a supreme strategic parameter; don't fall for any provocation or false flag black ops that would provide the casus belli for a US/British/Israel axis of war attack.

And all this while trends in the - overcast - horizon point to what could be dubbed an Asian Dollar Exclusion Zone, which for many sharp minds in the developing world might pave the way for an energy-backed currency used by the BRICS and the Group of 77 (G-77) to counter the increasingly desperate - and clueless - Atlanticist West.

Back to the European poodle parade, one just has to examine the joint statement issued by these mediocrity monstrosities - British Prime Minister David Cameron, German Chancellor Angela Merkel and neo-Napoleonic "liberator of Libya", French President Nicolas Sarkozy.

The trio said, "We have no quarrel with the Iranian people." Iraqis heard exactly the same thing from another set of mediocrities in 2002 and 2003. Then their country was invaded, occupied and destroyed.

.

:lol: .. Sparky, anybody home ? ?

MG, done deal


.

Thank You Very Much for your post, Azari.
MG, done deal
You may be right, Azari.

But other times Pepe :wink: gets skunked :wink:

Image

Sorry........... That one stunk :wink:

More seriously I have posted your links on the Spengler Board with credit given to you.........

http://spengler.atimes.net/viewtopic.ph ... 13#p442613
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Re: U$

Post by Marcus »

Well, gold and silver took a pretty good jump today . . and away we go?
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Re: U$

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

Marcus wrote:Well, gold and silver took a pretty good jump today . . and away we go?
Options close today. If the price closes above 1685 there is a good chance the downtrend has broken, but is should prove to be a wild day.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

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Re: U$

Post by Marcus »

Nonc Hilaire wrote:
Marcus wrote:Well, gold and silver took a pretty good jump today . . and away we go?
Options close today. If the price closes above 1685 there is a good chance the downtrend has broken, but is should prove to be a wild day.
I'll be watching. If memory serves, last year at this time silver was about $44/ounce. I sold some and used the money to get some yard work done around here . . crushed stone in the drive, some trees cut down, and a parking pad in back of the shop.

Would like to see gold and silver beat last year's highs. Lots more we'd like to do . . wife wants a new greenhouse . . :cry:
"The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon
******************
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Re: U$

Post by monster_gardener »

Marcus wrote:
Nonc Hilaire wrote:
Marcus wrote:Well, gold and silver took a pretty good jump today . . and away we go?
Options close today. If the price closes above 1685 there is a good chance the downtrend has broken, but is should prove to be a wild day.
I'll be watching. If memory serves, last year at this time silver was about $44/ounce. I sold some and used the money to get some yard work done around here . . crushed stone in the drive, some trees cut down, and a parking pad in back of the shop.

Would like to see gold and silver beat last year's highs. Lots more we'd like to do . . wife wants a new greenhouse . . :cry:
Thank you Very Much for your post, Marcus.

Would you please recommend some links to watch gold and especially silver prices........

Gold is almost certainly too rich for me but am considering a roll some of silver dimes in case things go bad.........

Sort of like Spengler and his gold IIRC but on a redneck budget........

Probably should have bought the day before yesterday........
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Re: U$

Post by Marcus »

monster_gardener wrote:Would you please recommend some links to watch gold and especially silver prices........
Here are current prices, mg, cruise the site for more information. I sold these folks some dime rolls last spring, and they paid what they said they would and when. Satisfied customer . .

http://www.silverandgoldexchange.com/se ... at-we-pay/
"The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
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Re: U$

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

4% is an average spread. Remember the US tax rate starts at 28% for profits on coin trading. Monex.com will sell you bags of junk silver, which is a not a bad option. If the financial apocalypse scenario does play out, it will be hard to find somebody who can make change for a gold bar.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

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Re: U$

Post by AzariLoveIran »

.

. . main reason behind America’s harsh stance is Tehran’s move to seek an alternative to the dollar as an oil currency.

.

At the heart of the issue is not Iran’s dubious attempt to build nuclear weapons, or even oil, but how that oil is paid for.

In 1973, Richard Nixon promised King Faisal of Saudi Arabia that the US would protect Saudi Arabian oilfields from any and all interested parties seeking to forcefully wrest them from the House of Saud. It’s important to remember that in 1973, Saudi Arabia didn’t have a fraction of the military and ground forces it possesses today (almost exclusively US manufactured weapons) and the USSR was very much a threat.

In return Saudi Arabia, and by extension OPEC, agreed to sell their oil in US dollars only. As if that weren’t sweet enough, as part of the deal, they were required to invest their profits in US treasuries, bonds and bills. The real zinger is that all countries purchasing oil from OPEC had to do so in US dollars, or ‘petrodollars’.

This strengthened the US dollar, resulting in a steady US economic growth cycle throughout the 80’s and 90’s. Countries purchasing OPEC oil started buying US treasury bills, bonds and securities to ensure they could continue purchasing OPEC oil. This worked fine for the US until 2001.

No plan, however well formulated, functions smoothly indefinitely.

2001, enter Saddam Hussein. He floated a plan to sell oil for European currencies in lieu of petrodollars. Shortly after Iraq was ‘suddenly’ found to be seeking and stockpiling weapons of mass destruction – allegations spearheaded by the US. The world knows what happened, suffice it to say that Saddam is dead and Iraq is ‘back on track’, selling its oil for petrodollars once again.

Muammar Gaddafi harbored the Lockerbie Bombers and allowed various terrorist organizations establish training camps in Libya. He tried to buy a nuke from China in 1972. In 1977, he approached Pakistan, then India. He sought nerve gas from Thailand. In spite of well over fifty failed assassination attempts on Gaddafi by Israel, the US and the UK, Libya was left to its own devices for the most part. Seeking nukes and harboring terrorists is one thing, but threatening the petrodollar is quite another. Gaddafi made a fatal error when he decided to move away from the petrodollar in favor of other currencies. This simply was not tolerated by the US. Having already played the WMD card in Iraq, something new was pulled from the US ‘regime change’ grab bag. Within a year, ‘internal’ elements rose up in rebellion against Gaddafi and now he is dead. Long live the petrodollar.

Dominique Strauss-Kahn, former head of the International Monetary Fund (IMF), suggested last year that the Euro would be a more suitable oil reserve currency than the US Dollar. Within three months of that statement, allegations of rape ruined his career, derailing his bid for the French Presidency in the process. Soon thereafter, all charges were dropped, but of course, le dommage était fait – the damage was done. Christine Lagarde, DSK’s replacement as head of the IMF sees no reason to change the current arrangement, naturellement.

The Iran situation is a little trickier. The US has sought to dismantle Iran’s regime ever since the 1979 Iranian Revolution, so this round of hostilities, while not new, reflects a new level of intensity. Why, after thirty years of hostility, has the US ratcheted up its rhetoric? As Obama stated in his recent State of the Union address, when it comes to Iran and the insistence they dismantle their nuclear program, “no options are off the table”. By stating ‘no options’ this would include nuclear deployment as a deterrent.

The answer of course is that Iran is now seeking to disengage itself from the petrodollar dynamic. In 2005, Iran sought to create an Iranian Oil Exchange, thus bypassing the US controlled petrodollar. Fear that western powers would freeze accounts in European and London banks put an end to that plan.

But that was not the end of their attempts, and Iran sought other ways to get around the petrodollar noose. There are rumors that India, which imports 12% of their oil from Iran, has agreed to purchase oil for gold. Energy trade with China, importing 15% of its oil and natural gas from Iran may be settled in gold, yuan, and rial. South Korea plans to buy 10% of their oil from Iran in 2012, and unless Seoul sides with American and European sanctions, it is likely to use gold or their sovereign currency to pay for it. Also, Iran is already dumping the dollar in its trade with Russia in favor of rials and rubles.

Iran is breaking the back of the petrodollar. Others have tried, but Iran is succeeding. To understand how disastrous this is for the US, one must have a basic understanding of how critical a role the petrodollar plays in the economic health of the US.

Through King Faisal, Nixon elevated the US to supreme economic ascendency, not unlike Damocles in his desire to rule. Sitting on the (economic) throne of the world is great, but Nixon was either unaware of the sword dangling over the US economic system, or chose to ignore it in favor of reaping the rewards of the moment.

By creating the petrodollar paradigm, the US economy soared, as all countries of the world were required to amass US currency to purchase oil from OPEC nations. Sales of T-bills, securities and US bonds soared. US coffers fattened. With the US dollar as the world’s oil currency reserve, economic fortune favored the US. But with great reward comes great risk. While other countries exchanged their currency for the dollar, (forfeiting value in the process) the US simply printed more money to match their needs and purchase their oil – essentially for free. The best example is that while gasoline in the US cost $3.00 per gallon, in Europe that same gallon costs $6.00 or more.

Herein lies the danger. If Iran is successful in its bid to set up their own bourse, or oil exchange, then what need does the world have for all those US dollars? The answer is none at all. As Iran creating gold and sovereign currency partnerships with India, China, South Korea and Russia, the hegemony of the petrodollar will be destroyed.

The resulting sell-off of US dollars, T-bills, securities, bonds and assets will flood the already swollen world economy with even more useless dollars, ultimately devaluing it into a position where hyper-inflation becomes a risk.

So, while the US government sabre-rattles and prattles on and on about nuclear weapons and the threat Iran poses to the Middle East, the thin veneer of lies spouted by the elite controlled media is being stripped away, revealing the truth of their warmongering rhetoric.

The US, by their foolish insistence on enforcing embargoes and sanctions against Iran, is hastening the end of the petrodollar and ushering in the age of US dollar hyper-inflation. A practical example: One loaf of bread in a healthy economy is $1.00. In an inflationary economy it’s $1.75. In a hyper-inflationary economy, $500.00.

Bullies may be large and dangerous, but rarely are they intelligent.

Damocles wisely vacated the throne of Dionysius before the sword fell upon his head, but the US is foolishly refusing to step down from their economic dais in spite of the catastrophic effect current policy direction will mean for US citizens and the world economy.

.

:lol:

.
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