Evolution

Advances in the investigation of the physical universe we live in.
Simple Minded

Re: Evolution

Post by Simple Minded »

noddy wrote:
Mr. Perfect wrote: When evolutionists tell me what they believe what do you want me to do with it.
assert, deny and repeat, never back down, never surrender.
Amen. (Is that in bad taste?) I want Mr. P to post often on the internet, and include lol in every post!
Mr. Perfect wrote: In the wallet. Evolution is a state funded religion and it has to come to an end. There is no science to support any of it.
noddy wrote:the refund would probably be less than the admin fee to separate it out from general science class.

I had to sit in divinity classes when i went to school even though im an atheist.

those guys believe in jewish space aliens making humans by hand out of mud and they didnt even have fossils or genetic studies to back it up, so the current approach is a tiny step forward .
Space aliens rule! They're still among us! Reptilians control the Bilderbergers who control both the Dems and the Repubs. The science is settled! It's just not repeated often enough! Join us to fight them! :P

lol
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Re: Evolution

Post by Mr. Perfect »

More fascist tactics from evolutionists. They are a threat to science.

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/07/ ... ur-fossil/
Attorneys for a California State University, Northridge scientist who was terminated from his job after discovering soft tissue on a triceratops fossil have filed a lawsuit against the university.

While at the Hell Creek Formation excavation site in Montana, researcher Mark Armitage discovered what he believed to be the largest triceratops horn ever unearthed at the site, according to attorney Brad Dacus of Pacific Justice Institute.

Upon examination of the horn under a high-powered microscope back at CSUN, Dacus says Armitage was “fascinated” to find soft tissue on the sample – a discovery Bacus said stunned members of the school’s biology department and even some students “because it indicates that dinosaurs roamed the earth only thousands of years in the past rather than going extinct 60 million years ago.”

“Since some creationists, like [Armitage], believe that the triceratops bones are only 4,000 years old at most, [Armitage’s] work vindicated his view that these dinosaurs roamed the planet relatively recently,” according to the complaint filed July 22 in Los Angeles Superior Court.

The lawsuit against the CSUN board of trustees cites discrimination for perceived religious views.

Armitage’s findings were eventually published in July 2013 in a peer-reviewed scientific journal.

According to court documents, shortly after the original soft tissue discovery, a CSUN official told Armitage, “We are not going to tolerate your religion in this department!”

Armitage, a published scientist of over 30 years, was subsequently let go after CSUN abruptly claimed his appointment at the university of 38 months had been temporary, and claimed a lack of funding for his position, according to attorneys.
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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: Evolution

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

.
Mr. Perfect wrote:.

More fascist tactics from evolutionists. They are a threat to science.

.

Seconded .. evolutionists idi*ts, traitors

LORD created our beloved Planet in 7 days, Monday he created the mountains, Tuesday the rivers and oceans, Wednesday the forest and fish and and and

And, all this happened 4,356 yrs, 234 days, 21 hrs, 26 minutes, 44 seconds ago (exact date calculated by a moron Catholic Cardinal - google it)

Really silly claiming humans come from Chimpanzee, some maybe, but for sure not all .. John Bolton for sure an exception, he probably from Chimpanzee tree

Pfui .. :lol: :lol: :D

.
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Typhoon
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Re: Evolution

Post by Typhoon »

Mr. Perfect wrote:More fascist tactics from evolutionists. They are a threat to science.

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/07/ ... ur-fossil/
Attorneys for a California State University, Northridge scientist who was terminated from his job after discovering soft tissue on a triceratops fossil have filed a lawsuit against the university.

While at the Hell Creek Formation excavation site in Montana, researcher Mark Armitage discovered what he believed to be the largest triceratops horn ever unearthed at the site, according to attorney Brad Dacus of Pacific Justice Institute.

Upon examination of the horn under a high-powered microscope back at CSUN, Dacus says Armitage was “fascinated” to find soft tissue on the sample – a discovery Bacus said stunned members of the school’s biology department and even some students “because it indicates that dinosaurs roamed the earth only thousands of years in the past rather than going extinct 60 million years ago.”

“Since some creationists, like [Armitage], believe that the triceratops bones are only 4,000 years old at most, [Armitage’s] work vindicated his view that these dinosaurs roamed the planet relatively recently,” according to the complaint filed July 22 in Los Angeles Superior Court.

The lawsuit against the CSUN board of trustees cites discrimination for perceived religious views.

Armitage’s findings were eventually published in July 2013 in a peer-reviewed scientific journal.

According to court documents, shortly after the original soft tissue discovery, a CSUN official told Armitage, “We are not going to tolerate your religion in this department!”

Armitage, a published scientist of over 30 years, was subsequently let go after CSUN abruptly claimed his appointment at the university of 38 months had been temporary, and claimed a lack of funding for his position, according to attorneys.
The paper published by Armitage et al. makes no claims as to the age of the fossil studied, only claims to provide evidence of soft sheets of fibrillar bone.

Soft sheets of fibrillar bone from a fossil of the supraorbital horn of the dinosaur Triceratops horridus

The actual paper provides no information as to what the issue may have been.

Contrary to the claims of the sadly uninformed and unfortunately biased article quoted, the presence of soft tissue in dinosaur bone was first discovered by Schweitzer at al. in a 68 million years old T. Rex specimen. This finding was as first controversial, however, subsequent work has found a candidate mechanism for soft tissue preservation.

LiveSci | Controversial T. Rex Soft Tissue Find Finally Explained

Still no evidence for the Jesus walked with the dinosaurs hypothesis.
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Re: Evolution

Post by Mr. Perfect »

Cool stories. However the issue at hand is that Evolutionists fired a scientist who didn't conform to evolutionary creation myths, a fascist tactic. Evolutionists often snark that no scientists reject evolution, but they also will not employ any scientists who reject their creation myths as evidenced here. Nice little con you guys have going.
These are claims not science.

Schweitzer THINKS she has the answer: Iron. emphasis added.
Still no evidence for the Jesus walked with the dinosaurs hypothesis.
That's great. No one claimed this.

Something tells me that you don't know anything about the creation story. Maybe if you studied it you would start believing it.
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Typhoon
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Re: Evolution

Post by Typhoon »

Mr. Perfect wrote:Cool stories. However the issue at hand is that Evolutionists fired a scientist who didn't conform to evolutionary creation myths, a fascist tactic. Evolutionists often snark that no scientists reject evolution, but they also will not employ any scientists who reject their creation myths as evidenced here. Nice little con you guys have going.
These are claims not science.

Schweitzer THINKS she has the answer: Iron. emphasis added.
Still no evidence for the Jesus walked with the dinosaurs hypothesis.
That's great. No one claimed this.

Something tells me that you don't know anything about the creation story. Maybe if you studied it you would start believing it.
I have. It was an enjoyable bit of fiction.

Still a bit puzzled that Adam and Eve had two sons, but still managed to populate the planet. Reminded me of a naughty JAV storyline.
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Re: Evolution

Post by Mr. Perfect »

What's puzzling about it.
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Simple Minded

Re: Evolution

Post by Simple Minded »

Heracleum Persicum wrote:.
Mr. Perfect wrote:.

More fascist tactics from evolutionists. They are a threat to science.

.

Seconded .. evolutionists idi*ts, traitors

LORD created our beloved Planet in 7 days, Monday he created the mountains, Tuesday the rivers and oceans, Wednesday the forest and fish and and and

And, all this happened 4,356 yrs, 234 days, 21 hrs, 26 minutes, 44 seconds ago (exact date calculated by a moron Catholic Cardinal - google it)

Really silly claiming humans come from Chimpanzee, some maybe, but for sure not all .. John Bolton for sure an exception, he probably from Chimpanzee tree

Pfui .. :lol: :lol: :D

.
HP,

Ancient aliens dude! Some one from one of Earth's oldest civilizations should know this. ;)
Simple Minded

Re: Evolution

Post by Simple Minded »

Typhoon wrote:
Still a bit puzzled that Adam and Eve had two sons, but still managed to populate the planet. Reminded me of a naughty JAV storyline.
well, ya know, families were a lot closer then, ;) if you get my drift. ;) ;)

Still happens today in West Virginia and Arkansas.....

Why does no one want to marry a 14 year old virgin girl from West Virginia?
Cause if she ain' t good enough for her family, she ain't good enough for you!
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Typhoon
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Re: Evolution

Post by Typhoon »

Simple Minded wrote:
Heracleum Persicum wrote:.
Mr. Perfect wrote:.

More fascist tactics from evolutionists. They are a threat to science.

.

Seconded .. evolutionists idi*ts, traitors

LORD created our beloved Planet in 7 days, Monday he created the mountains, Tuesday the rivers and oceans, Wednesday the forest and fish and and and

And, all this happened 4,356 yrs, 234 days, 21 hrs, 26 minutes, 44 seconds ago (exact date calculated by a moron Catholic Cardinal - google it)

Really silly claiming humans come from Chimpanzee, some maybe, but for sure not all .. John Bolton for sure an exception, he probably from Chimpanzee tree

Pfui .. :lol: :lol: :D

.
HP,

Ancient aliens dude! Some one from one of Earth's oldest civilizations should know this. ;)
Well, Muslim societies have something else in common with Christian literalists - fundamentalists [as opposed to other Christian sects].
Neither have contributed to the ongoing scientific-industrial revolution that started three centuries ago.

In the case of Muslim societies, they've been absent since the 13th century.
Pity.
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Typhoon
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Re: Evolution

Post by Typhoon »

Simple Minded wrote:
Typhoon wrote:
Still a bit puzzled that Adam and Eve had two sons, but still managed to populate the planet. Reminded me of a naughty JAV storyline.
well, ya know, families were a lot closer then, ;) if you get my drift. ;) ;)

Still happens today in West Virginia and Arkansas.....

Why does no one want to marry a 14 year old virgin girl from West Virginia?
Cause if she ain' t good enough for her family, she ain't good enough for you!
Ouch. I wasn't going to go there as that part of the USA has more than its fair share of MSM stereotypes.

Have driven through the Appalachian Mountains. Very beautiful country.
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Typhoon
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Re: Evolution

Post by Typhoon »

Quanta Mag | Seeing Emergent Physics Behind Evolution
Nigel Goldenfeld applies the physics of condensed matter to understand why evolution was blazingly fast for the earliest life — and then slowed down.
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Re: Evolution

Post by Typhoon »

May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
Simple Minded

Re: Evolution

Post by Simple Minded »

Hmmmm... me thinks we need a law banning monkeys from blogging on the internet......
Simple Minded

Re: Evolution

Post by Simple Minded »

Typhoon wrote:
Ouch. I wasn't going to go there as that part of the USA has more than its fair share of MSM stereotypes.

Have driven through the Appalachian Mountains. Very beautiful country.
Also true in Canada (I don't want to be accused of being a Nationalist) Recently spent a wonderful day in West Virginia, working outside, clearing land with a chainsaw (a battle to the death with Mother Nature and the forces of entropy.). Sunshine, 55 degrees, 4-8 mph breeze. 360 degree panoramic views of at least 15 miles, with no more than a couple dozen house in sight total.

Not at all hard to understand why someone raised in a rural setting would be more inclined to believe in God than someone raised in an urban location.

Nature or nurture or God's will?

The good part about faith is it can be whatever anyone wants it to be. Seven billion people, seven billion variations.

God: "WTF is wrong with you people! I gave you free will damnit! Now use it to mind your own f**king business!!!"

The bad part is how the less moral person may use faith.

"Judge not lest ye be judged." when you are in a benevolent mood.

"Judge righteous judgments." when you want to go on the warpath.

"I can do no wrong! Cause God thinks just like me!! Which completely destroys the theory of evolution in one sentence." :D
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Re: Evolution

Post by Typhoon »

Mr. Perfect wrote: . . .
These are claims not science.

Schweitzer THINKS she has the answer: Iron. emphasis added.
Missed the main point. The soft tissue finding does not invalidate the well established age of the fossil at 68 million years.

Schweitzer has proposed a hypothesis on how this can occur. Further research will provide evidence for or against.
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Re: Evolution

Post by Mr. Perfect »

I certainly got the point, it just so happens to be wrong. Soft tissue does incredible damage to the evolutionist belief of the age of Dinosaurs. Schweizer's claims settle nothing, and in fact are just claims no different than you or I would make.
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Re: Evolution

Post by noddy »

the amusing part is that if you are correct, this will just strengthen the scientific atheist position and furthur erode belief in supernatural first causes.

their will be even more evidence for an even stronger theory, that would be great.
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Re: Evolution

Post by Mr. Perfect »

The discovery of soft tissue in dinosaurs has been a tremendous boon to creationism. They are cashing in on it left and right. The quality of creationist content these days is off the charts.
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Re: Evolution

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Mr. Perfect wrote:The discovery of soft tissue in dinosaurs has been a tremendous boon to creationism. They are cashing in on it left and right. The quality of creationist content these days is off the charts.
Rather, they are once again demonstrating that they are willfully clueless about the process of science.

Cashing in the same way as late comers in a US Marine biscuit circle jerk.
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Re: Evolution

Post by Typhoon »

Nature | Massive genetic study shows how humans are evolving
Analysis of 215,000 people's DNA suggests variants that shorten life are being selected against.
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Re: Evolution

Post by NapLajoieonSteroids »

I've never understood the "who did Adam and Eve's children have sex with" retort.

Even if we are to grant every objection to the Biblical narrative, and agree it is unreliable ; we still face the same scenario where there must have been a cardinal group of human possessing our type of ratiocination-- or at least the processes-- and a method for how they overcame their novel situation to dominate.

And again, that's granting everything....that there is a 100% genetic material explanation for this sort of consciousness/symbol-mongering and our group of primates, at least 10,000 at minimum carried our physiological "human-ness" or the capability; so it spread rapidly because of its adaptive fitness....the whole kit and caboodle.

The two common objections to that then become: a) trying to argue from some sort of evolutionary accreditation into consciousness and beyond, and b)the denial of its existence altogether.

In the case of the latter, the arguments end up convoluted, empty - often both- and as far as I'm concerned, not worth getting mired in.

In the case of the latter a, even agreeing that the process has been refined exponentially by natural causes over millenias (and we would have no reason not to agree, ) it's not an answer or proof of anything. Often, this argument tries to sneak through some sort of weird conception of semi- or quasi-consciousness which is one of those extremely silly ideas only smart people would latch onto and promote. 'Cause at the heart of it, it's trying to have its cake and eat it too- accordingly, the story of humanity would rest on semi-pregnant primates becoming less semi-pregnant over a long, drawn out process; just so. If we were to take this at face value, there could never be a first dude explaining to his girlfriend that she's only semi-pregnant to begin with!

What we understand of an evolutionary process and the fossil record, even humoring the idea, major changes often aren't gradual accumulations like that. And to drive it into the ground: gradations from pre-consciousness into consciousness isn't a thing.

So what we are left with is the same minor conundrum* of how our first family of symbol mongers conquered the world; with multiple stories attached which suffer from plot holes or missing information and no satisfying explanations or methods to derive one under our presenting understanding and information at hand- except the conclusion that it did so happen that we went from point A to point B as demonstrated by our current existence.

*And in both cases, narrative wise, detailing this step isn't all that important to either ancient writers and or modern ones; but for some reason, only Christians and Jews are supposed to account for this.
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Re: Evolution

Post by noddy »

i see no evidence for the uniqueness of human rationality nor the hard lines of species separation in the world around me.

its all matters of degree - we have more language/symbology and more tool usage than anything else but thats like saying an elephant has more nose.
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Re: Evolution

Post by NapLajoieonSteroids »

noddy wrote:i see no evidence for the uniqueness of human rationality nor the hard lines of species separation in the world around me.

its all matters of degree - we have more language/symbology and more tool usage than anything else but thats like saying an elephant has more nose.
I may agree with you about no hard line of species separatism but that is different from saying there are no lines, even if they are in flux in the scheme of things.

But as for conceptual thinking, it is most certainly not a matter of degrees.

Our symbol-deriving may not be as important as the physiological differences we possess from our joints and bipedalism to our dentition to our cranial capacities; we are most certain an animal species and not severed from the rest of earth's species. We also run on the same or similiar perceptions (including the deliberative ability to think imaginatively)/instinctual/emotional software as the other critters around us- and 99% of our lives runs on that alone. In this regard, we are indeed "more nose".

Yet, despite the best efforts of some to convince us all sorts of animals can do it too, I've yet to meet a squirrel who can ponder round-ness.

Tool making, (most) communicative behavior can be explained by imagination, instinct and habit; but conceptual thinking is a whole other kettle of fish. And one distinct to us as best as the evidence shows.

All the best press in the world couldn't defeat the skepticism that Koko couldn't really "speak" and was responding merely to her handlers signs coupled with her possessing keen perceptive and volitional abilities. But no one doubts Helen Keller getting the concept of "water" despite being deaf and blind or that humans as a species play around with concepts all the time. {see the math and physics departments. }

To say otherwise is more akin to saying that any precursor-respiratory hole on a body is a 'nose'; at some point you cross that threshold and you've either got it or you don't (or you may possess some sort of alternative- even then, you wouldn't say creatures who breathe through their skin possess all nose either.
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Re: Evolution

Post by noddy »

hang on a tick.

ive known plenty of blokes whos conversation ability didnt extend much beyond a dog or monkeys - mostly eyebrows with a few tonal variations to back it up.

also, maybe no squirrels but how about parrots.

https://www.upi.com/Science_News/2016/0 ... 469020602/
CAMBRIDGE, Mass., July 20 (UPI) -- New research proves parrots know their shapes, even those hiding in optical illusions.

Kanizsa's Triangle is a famous illusory contours, a visual illusion whereby the impression of a triangle is intimated by several inward-facing Pac-Man-like figures.

The triangle is one of several geometric mirages recognized by a parrot named Griffin. Researchers at Harvard found Griffin was able to identify a variety of occluded shapes, as well as Kanizsa figures with up to six sides.

Researchers trained Griffin to recognize a variety of shapes on plain pieces of paper. They varied in color and size, but the training aids did not visually recall the Kanizsa figures.

"There is no commonality image-wise between the real 3-D triangle and the Kanizsa triangle," psychologist Ken Nakayama told the Harvard Gazette. "Yet Griffin has made that connection."

It's a connection that many deep-learning computer algorithms fail to make, and researchers believe Griffin may be able to help scientists understand why.
again, this is matters of degree to me.
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