Climate change and other predictions of Imminent Doom

Advances in the investigation of the physical universe we live in.
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Endovelico
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Endovelico »

noddy wrote:
Simple Minded wrote:
ignorance also needs no sales staff.......
ignorance is hard work, constant vigilance is required.
:D
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Nonc Hilaire
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

The Pope is not a scientist, but the biblical 'creation mandate' http://ourreasonforhope.blogspot.com/20 ... ndate.html is a widely accepted interpretation. This is where he bases his belief that mankind is intended to be the steward of the earth and not its rapist.

Global warming is a popularized public term which is pretty much synonymous (in the general public) with what we used to call environmentalism. The Pope is not debating the narrow scientific or political implications of AGW. He is preaching a fundamental attitude using popular language.

If one listens to him in relation to how well he fits with politics or science, they are missing the point and listening for the wrong reasons. The Pope is preaching ethics, not pushing policy.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

Teresa of Ávila
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Typhoon
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Typhoon »

re: Popes

Earl Butz said it best, in another context, decades ago
He no play a da game, he no make a da rules.
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
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Endovelico
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Endovelico »

re: Popes

Earl Butz said it best, in another context, decades ago
He no play a da game, he no make a da rules.
Reading some of our shogun's posts is like watching a black and white second rate movie from the '50s. It wasn't any good or funny then, and it is even worse now. But what can you expect from someone who gets all starry-eyed with pictures of Joan Crawford or Rita Hayworth...
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Nonc Hilaire
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

Typhoon wrote:re: Popes

Earl Butz said it best, in another context, decades ago
He no play a da game, he no make a da rules.
Butz was well named. The referee is never a player.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

Teresa of Ávila
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Typhoon
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

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May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
Simple Minded

Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Simple Minded »

Excellent article! Thanks. Very similar to people emotionally herding in the financial markets. What is the fashionable trend du jour?

"The markets may remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent!"

Ego, money, and the desire for celebrity. Few can resist, especially in the face of consistent perverse incentives.
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Typhoon
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Typhoon »

Nonc Hilaire wrote:
Typhoon wrote:re: Popes

Earl Butz said it best, in another context, decades ago
He no play a da game, he no make a da rules.
Butz was well named. The referee is never a player.
9zzbmbDOhh8
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
Simple Minded

Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Simple Minded »

Is it just me, or is it getting harder to discern "Science as Religion" from "Religion as Science?"

The Religion as Science guys are the ones wearing nightshirts and funny hats. right?
And the Science as Religion are the ones who say "If you don't agree with me, you can go to Hell!' rather than If you don't agree with me, you are going to Hell!" right?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eur ... story.html

Luckily, the experts in both camps have impeccable records of accuracy.....

Pick a herd and moooooooove along.....
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Nonc Hilaire
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

Simple Minded wrote:Is it just me, or is it getting harder to discern "Science as Religion" from "Religion as Science?"

The Religion as Science guys are the ones wearing nightshirts and funny hats. right?
And the Science as Religion are the ones who say "If you don't agree with me, you can go to Hell!' rather than If you don't agree with me, you are going to Hell!" right?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eur ... story.html

Luckily, the experts in both camps have impeccable records of accuracy.....

Pick a herd and moooooooove along.....
I don't quite get your point. Science has obviously been corrupted by the government supported university system and corporate largesse. We have covered this well in other threads about scientism and bad research.

Religion is not as cohesive an entity, and fewer people are religious. Here the media selects which religious ideas to showcase, and 'man bites dog' is news but 'dog bites man' is not interesting. The mainstream get little attention, but in science only the mainstream get tenure and funding.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

Teresa of Ávila
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Yukon Cornelius
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Yukon Cornelius »

“@CTMinBC: On CO2, "most of what you can do has already been done."—physicist William Happer.

http://t.co/j8YSFY0wdd
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Typhoon
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Typhoon »

Yukon Cornelius wrote:“@CTMinBC: On CO2, "most of what you can do has already been done."—physicist William Happer.

http://t.co/j8YSFY0wdd
Very good exposition in the video. Thank you.

128317908

Indeed.

Image

That's log2([CO2]/[CO2]o) | CO2 concentration [CO2] over a baseline value [CO2]o as the log must be dimensionless.
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
Simple Minded

Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Simple Minded »

Nonc Hilaire wrote: I don't quite get your point. Science has obviously been corrupted by the government supported university system and corporate largesse. We have covered this well in other threads about scientism and bad research.

Religion is not as cohesive an entity, and fewer people are religious. Here the media selects which religious ideas to showcase, and 'man bites dog' is news but 'dog bites man' is not interesting. The mainstream get little attention, but in science only the mainstream get tenure and funding.
I agree. I was simply pondering those I know who are firmly biased in the camp of religion as truth, or the camp of science as truth, and who think those who are in the other camp as stupid and/or insane. Are their respective faiths shaken, by the momentary coming together of the opposing camp ground councilors?

Both camps have their share of sincere, honest, disciplined, practitioners, yet also charlatans.

Even by observing the behavior or preaching of some members of either camp, it may be difficult to discern to which camp they belong.

Media reporting of religion should be trusted even less than media reporting of science. 'It is hard to get someone to understand something when their paycheck is dependent upon them not understanding."
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Nonc Hilaire
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

Religion is not much use in determining HOW to science, but essential in influencing WHAT to science. Pope Francis is kinda mixed up on AGW, but if you read him at any depth it's obvious he is making a plea for science to prioritize environmentalism and not really getting into the how of AGW.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

Teresa of Ávila
noddy
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by noddy »

when deforrestation, over fishing, pollution etc all get lumped into more-taxes-please global warming, conversation ends.

im seeing popey everywhere on this topic, its very odd, did the entire western world suddenly become catholic.
ultracrepidarian
Simple Minded

Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Simple Minded »

Nonc Hilaire wrote:Religion is not much use in determining HOW to science, but essential in influencing WHAT to science. Pope Francis is kinda mixed up on AGW, but if you read him at any depth it's obvious he is making a plea for science to prioritize environmentalism and not really getting into the how of AGW.
The pope has a tough row to hoe on this matter. Appeal to the masses using a currently chic topic, which requires he adopt their lexicon, all the while trying to not sound like one of the "science as religion" fanatics/charlatans who claim their data, hypothesizes, and computer models are divine.... and.... " therefore beyond contestation."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l__CoI4uVCo

At the bottom, he is discussing nothing more than personal responsibility. One would think he could cover the topic quite well in less than 10 pages, but then there is the bureaucracy that requires employment and therefore deployment......
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Typhoon
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

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Have to say that I prefer a tough hoe to row over a tough row to hoe.
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
Simple Minded

Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Simple Minded »

Typhoon wrote:Have to say that I prefer a tough ho' (typo fixed :) ) to row over a tough row to hoe.
In hindsight, the Pope probably wishes he had you on his science Advisory board...... or the Papal council on public relations.... ;)

I'm sure there will be some openings soon.....
Simple Minded

Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Simple Minded »

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/1168 ... lieve.html

Excellent description of the power of emotional herding in the creation of bubbles:


"One of these was the peculiar way in which Europe’s politicians, with full support from the US, had set out to unite their continent under a form of supra-national government unlike anything the world had seen before. The other was the way those same politicians fell for the idea not just that human activities were disastrously changing Earth’s climate, but that by taking the most drastic measures they could somehow change it back again.

Although for quite a time these two belief systems seemed to carry all before them, each was essentially based on a fantasy view of the world; and it is in the nature of trying to act out a fantasy that it must eventually overreach itself, to the point where it collides unpleasantly with reality."

My wife & I were both raised Catholic. Prior to his venturing into the realm of global warming, she loved this pope. The other day we heard a bishop speaking in defense of the pope and warning against acting in terms of one's "self-interest." :shock:

My wife looked at me and said "I wonder how long it will be until the Vatican decides to practice what they preach and liquidate their art treasures and real estate holdings and donate the proceeds to the poor."

I replied "I'm guessing that global warming will reverse, the Coming Ice Age will be intellectually fashionable again, and Hell will freeze over first."
Simple Minded

NYC.... RIP!

Post by Simple Minded »

Tis now July 1, 2015, which means NYC has gone into Altantis mode thanks to AGW....

Damn shame, er, uh, wait did it really happen?

As Zack noted, "ocean levels can be measured with millimeter precision"...... too bad the computer models have an error factor of at least 5 orders of magnitude....., er, uh, wait, no that's a good thing. :)
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Typhoon
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

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All the imminent doom unless we act now stories leading up the Paris conference and

Image
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
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Typhoon
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

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May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
Simple Minded

Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Simple Minded »

Excellent presentation. Thanks! Good to hear the opinions of a "practical" scientist. I liked his opinions on ethanol.

Those with little or no knowledge of physics can be coerced into believing almost anything.

What does a "scientist" do when the hypothesis is dependent on hyper-accurate measurements..... and even the supposedly hyper-accurate measurements do not support the hypothesis?

Call in the witchdoctors?

How accurately can one measure a strawberry or a herring? 0.0001"? Has anyone noticed how the increase in human mass can be measured in dozens of pounds or feet?

Someday the old joke about lawyers (98% of lawyers give the rest a bad name!), will be applied to climate scientists.
Simple Minded

Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

Post by Simple Minded »

Is a mini ICE AGE on the way? Scientists warn the sun will 'go to sleep' in 2030 and could cause temperatures to plummet
New study claims to have cracked predicting solar cycles
Says that between 2030 and 2040 solar cycles will cancel each other out
Could lead to 'Maunder minimum' effect that saw River Thames freeze over

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... ummet.html

FINALLY! AGW is solved!!! :D
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Typhoon
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Re: Climate and the Anthropogenic Global Warming Controversy

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As a physicist friend has often observed, "the track record of experts in predicting the future is no better than that of astrologers".
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
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