On Ladders and Terrorists

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
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Parodite
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On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Parodite »

Ladders are more dangerous than terrorists.

This is what statistics say about those two threats. It does not seem rational to be all worked up by terrorism as if doom for all is near when ladders and certainly cars or alcohol make many more victims.

So a valid question seems to be why this is the case. If climbing a ladder is more dangerous than being in a crowded place somewhere in the world where a terrorist attack might occur, then why do ladders not freak us out?

Ladders have a big advantage over terrorists:

1. They don't have legs, eyes or a hungry mouth with sharp teeth.
2. They don't think and are unable to make plans for the future.
3. They are honest about the danger of climbing it. The risk is obvious, visible and local. Your body understands it immediately without thinking.

You are therefor free to take the risk and climb it or decide avoiding the risk by not climbing it. The ladder gives you full control over your own actions, which is a smart tactic because it makes you feel safe. This way it seduces you to climb the ladder despite the dangers.

Compare that to the strategy of terrorists. They advertise their danger as loud as possible and make sure you see how their dead and maimed victims look like. They know there are always enough cameras around and that they will be in the news for a long long time. And they have legs, eyes and a brain to make plans with guns and bombs to kill people. That makes them much more scary than ladders, even though ladders statistically make more victims. But this is inevitable because we are biologically wired that way. It is our first instinctive response. A rational evaluation of risk only comes second, looking up statistics on the internet third probably the next day or week, if at all. To tell people they should look at the statistics first is to deny them their biological humanity.

If the sole goal of terrorists is to kill as much as possible people they might need ask ladders how to do better. Or cars that in comparison to ladders are genocidal. Since they don't, it appears that what they want is something different: create as much fear and chaos as possible with the right amount of terrorist acts needed for that. Assuming of course these terrorists are rational and have clear goals in mind. Which often can be questioned, but it is a good idea to assume such rationality to exist since underestimating them is never a good idea.

In already destabilized environments like Irak, Syria and Libya, fear-mongering does not seem to be the only goal of terrorists. Killing is part of old fashioned warfare to gain political power. Terrorism and combat combined. In the West however, still very organized and strong, their chance to take control of our societies is close to nill. Maybe they manage to kill more frequently and more outrageously; it is a matter of time before they will walk into secondary schools and gun down tens of children and teachers here. They might also pull off a dirty bomb or two, but nothing that will enable them to take political control any time soon. Especially because most Muslims don't like violent ultra-orthodox Islamism either; most victims world-wide of Islamic terrorism are Muslims.

Inevitably, non-violent Muslims and non-violent non-Muslims in the West will join forces against violent Islamo-fascism without wasting time any longer on detached politically correct discussions on racism or Islamophobia that make everybody look the wrong way. Islamic terrorism will continue to make victims in the West but its Islamo-fascist political ideology that feeds it has no future here. Before that to happen there would be a civil war first and then all bets are off.
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Parodite
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Memo from Alt Ladder United

Post by Parodite »

Memo from Alt Ladder United

We, the Alt Ladder have United. It is now clear that we are compared to terrorists and considered more dangerous. Thank you for pointing it out. Because supposedly we make more victims. But this is outrageous. Not only because it is not us who kill (certainly not intentionally) but people who take risks at their own peril by stepping on us. We don't even bite when they do. And there is more.

We not only do not bite when stepped upon nor protest in any other fashion, more importantly we don't produce memes. We are not burdened with huge frontal lobes and have usually nothing to talk about! You have forgotten that peace. You were there before you were born but no memory exists of it. Heaven is not a take-away. Next time you see a ladder you see paradise. Remember that before you compare us with terrorists!

We don't spread anything that might f*ck up other people's minds. And how easy to f*ck up they are! Whores with their legs spread wide open 24/7. Just look at history. All that you have swallowed willingly, or was pushed through your throats, the ugly ideological babies you have produced. Many under the guise of religion. Your utter confusion. You want roses but always end up with thorns.

We from Alt Ladder United had to wait with this memo. As the best moment for our defence before The Council. For the fallout and crazy fog after Charlottesville, with Barcelona just as a reminder. To make our case with the truth in front of your eyes.

Fires can remain local, contained by some law and ordah or natural barriers. But there is old knowledge, hundreds of thousands of years of experience: fires can spread very quickly. Wild fires. It is natural. Human brains are like forests. Memes are sparks. Which is why people respond so strongly to them even when a fire is still small or far away. They smell the smoke when the wind blows in their direction, know how fast a fire can travel to their door step. Alertness, sometimes panic.

Those who claim to be rational by pointing out how small and local fires are don't understand wild fires. How they always happen and throughout history. How just around the corner they are in fact. It would be rational to investigate how small fires can prevented becoming a destructive wild fire; to just say that a fire is small and nothing to worry about because it is small is irresponsible if not plain stupid.

Size doesn't matter, how to prevent and contain fires does. Fire fighters often use ladders to save people by the way.
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Mr. Perfect
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Mr. Perfect »

Great points. I've been thinking about this for 25 years. Or more.

If one were to look at statistical death threats in the United States we might consider spending the Military budget on home gardens for people, as food causes almost all premature death.

Also, liberals created the idea of "hate crime' some decades ago. It's a strange idea, as if being murdered could be worse depending on the circumstances. Some murder is worse than others in this view. It's better to be murdered in a home invasion than at a gay bar. Getting murdered at a gay bar is the worst murder I think.

Obviously problematic, but I began thinking it might have value in measuring crime trends. That is, in different categories of crime the government puts in certain efforts to fight that crime and cost benefit ratio is established in terms of finding out what a "normal" rate of murder is. However a hate crime is a way where you could say "hey here is some disproportionate crime, maybe we could allocate resources in such a way to get a large return on investment for the effort". Along those lines.

So with that in mind we must ask, is terrorism a special crime?

I think so. Why? Because of the intent. Terrorism is a political crime designed to change a body politic. As such it is not so much a threat to life and limb but sovereignty and self government itself. As such it requires special attention.
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

Homicide has always had multiple charges dependent upon intention in common law. First, second, third degree, manslaughter, negligent homicide, numerous extenuating circumstances.
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by noddy »

its not about the terrorists, its about the government taking deeper control over our communications and transport infrastructure.

they fell over themselves to babble about how the world had changed post 9/11 and all the muppets agreed with them.

freedom is bad, its full of racist terrorists and robber barrons.
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Parodite »

Alt Ladder United wrote:
It is a long sit, but worth watching. These three heroes are on the Night's Watch that guard the Wall in the North. They went through the gate and have seen what is coming. Or what might be coming and why.

6G59zsjM2UI

Some are confident that the immune system of Western society is strong enough to resist groupthink. But it is a false sense of security. It only holds true when people are fed well and raw violence sufficiently managed by law and law enforcement. When an economic collapse enters the equations, the already mentally charged, mobalized and antagonized mobs will be at each others throat in no time. Wild fire. The power vacuums that emerge are soon filled by psychopaths. Who don't mind blood flowing or simply love it. The assumed robust immunity against groupthink and mob violence is gone very fast.
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Simple Minded

Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Simple Minded »

Parodite wrote:
Alt Ladder United wrote:
It is a long sit, but worth watching. These three heroes are on the Night's Watch that guard the Wall in the North. They went through the gate and have seen what is coming. Or what might be coming and why.

6G59zsjM2UI

Some are confident that the immune system of Western society is strong enough to resist groupthink. But it is a false sense of security. It only holds true when people are fed well and raw violence sufficiently managed by law and law enforcement. When an economic collapse enters the equations, the already mentally charged, mobalized and antagonized mobs will be at each others throat in no time. Wild fire. The power vacuums that emerge are soon filled by psychopaths. Who don't mind blood flowing or simply love it. The assumed robust immunity against groupthink and mob violence is gone very fast.
Parodite,

thanks for posting. I look forward to viewing. Group think, and labeling oneself and others by herd identity is one of my favorite subjects.

White, black, brown, right, left, etc. all defined by the observer. Intent of the observed, or for that matter reality itself be damned.

The immune system of "Western Society" is strong enough to resist groupthink..... Didn't we just drop into the group think trap with the label of "Western Society?"

Many sacred cows, many careers, and much money at risk here.

That's just the way "those people" are. ;)
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Parodite »

Simple Minded wrote:Parodite,

thanks for posting. I look forward to viewing. Group think, and labeling oneself and others by herd identity is one of my favorite subjects.

White, black, brown, right, left, etc. all defined by the observer. Intent of the observed, or for that matter reality itself be damned.

The immune system of "Western Society" is strong enough to resist groupthink..... Didn't we just drop into the group think trap with the label of "Western Society?"

Many sacred cows, many careers, and much money at risk here.

That's just the way "those people" are. ;)
Well, it might depend on how "they", especially we the future "us", think about it. They might not agree with any of us now! ;) They might even consider "I" delusional, an imaginary product of groupthink. Sort of radical Buddhism that negated, exorcised all selves. Or a theism that believes God, at one undisclosed moment in Time, was fractured (probably due to a breaking of symmetry of sorts, major mayhem in the divine ecosystem) into a crowd of divine Selves all believing they are the One. Cosmic Multiple Personality Disorder that benefits "everybody", especially rugged individualist libertarians. :P

Would all make the world so much more interesting. I mean, how would individuals and teams compete in sports? "You" win but "I" claim victory? We all lost, or won? Zero-sum reality looms ahead when differences are no more. It was all predicted by the prophets long ago.

Revelation 21:
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

Sounds to me like God's MPD will be cured, the Many being One again. A hope and desire, that is.

Caveat: this imagine of promised undivided Unity is more likely a description of death -> be careful what you wish for. The glorification of death, self-sacrifice with rewards waiting at the other end. A promise, or desperate last resort. The rejection of differences as they exist, and change... all the time. The assault on you and me, us and them. Where there should be only one... Us.

I refuse to let "you" go yet, SM. Even as a figment of "my" own imagination. ;)
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Simple Minded

Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Simple Minded »

Parodite wrote:
Well, it might depend on how "they", especially we the future "us", think about it. They might not agree with any of us now! ;) They might even consider "I" delusional, an imaginary product of groupthink. Sort of radical Buddhism that negated, exorcised all selves. Or a theism that believes God, at one undisclosed moment in Time, was fractured (probably due to a breaking of symmetry of sorts, major mayhem in the divine ecosystem) into a crowd of divine Selves all believing they are the One. Cosmic Multiple Personality Disorder that benefits "everybody", especially rugged individualist libertarians. :P

Would all make the world so much more interesting. I mean, how would individuals and teams compete in sports? "You" win but "I" claim victory? We all lost, or won? Zero-sum reality looms ahead when differences are no more. It was all predicted by the prophets long ago.

Revelation 21:
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

Sounds to me like God's MPD will be cured, the Many being One again. A hope and desire, that is.

Caveat: this imagine of promised undivided Unity is more likely a description of death -> be careful what you wish for. The glorification of death, self-sacrifice with rewards waiting at the other end. A promise, or desperate last resort. The rejection of differences as they exist, and change... all the time. The assault on you and me, us and them. Where there should be only one... Us.

I refuse to let "you" go yet, SM. Even as a figment of "my" own imagination. ;)
:lol:

Amen!!! My thoughts exactly, but then, as a product of your imagination, you knew what I was going to type even before I typed it, didn't you? You magnificent, omniscient bastard! I promise that now, and for ever more, my imaginary self will never let you down! And if I ever do, it ain't really my fault, is it?

I like the thought of death as the great equalizer, the eternal promise of equality that we all fear. WTF is wrong with us? Entering heaven today is within the reach and power of all of us at anytime! A refreshing glass of hemlock anyone?

I appreciate the kinds words. I too, am proud of the "you" I have created with "my" imagination. Some of my best work, if I do say so myself! Way to go me!

You're a much better product than the Tinker or Zack or Mr. Perfect I've imagined. I just can't get those personas right. But I'm gonna keep practicing. ;)

On a more serious note, whenever I hear Joe in the street, or an "expert" say "This is how Americans or Europeans or democrats or republicans or whites ( I accidentally typed witches, hmmm) or blacks think/behave/act/feel!" I often think, "Really, have you met them all? What about the ones that disagree with your assessment?"

Of course, the answer REALLY is "The ones I label as X's, think like X"s. The others aren't really true X's. Trust me!" :P

That's the real trick isn't it? Keeping the "We" that is in a state of continual flux and evolution, functioning as a cohesive unit, and aiming for the ever moving goalposts. The sub units are always the problem!
Simple Minded

Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Simple Minded »

Anyone who disagrees with me is an opinion essentialist or maybe an opinionated existentialist!

I'm not sure...... :(
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Miss_Faucie_Fishtits »

Image
She irons her jeans, she's evil.........
Simple Minded

Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Simple Minded »

Parodite wrote:
Alt Ladder United wrote:
It is a long sit, but worth watching. These three heroes are on the Night's Watch that guard the Wall in the North. They went through the gate and have seen what is coming. Or what might be coming and why.

6G59zsjM2UI

Some are confident that the immune system of Western society is strong enough to resist groupthink. But it is a false sense of security. It only holds true when people are fed well and raw violence sufficiently managed by law and law enforcement. When an economic collapse enters the equations, the already mentally charged, mobalized and antagonized mobs will be at each others throat in no time. Wild fire. The power vacuums that emerge are soon filled by psychopaths. Who don't mind blood flowing or simply love it. The assumed robust immunity against groupthink and mob violence is gone very fast.
Up to one hour and 16 minutes. Good stuff.

Kinda cool to see how people who get paid to think for a living can split hairs so well. Love the vocabulary.

A "biological essentialist" can be both a victim and an oppressor!

Knowing this, you'd think people would be happier.... :?
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by noddy »

of course this begs the question, what if terrorists start using and/or designing ladders.
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Typhoon »

Reason | V.S. Naipaul: 'Terrorists Can Fly a Plane, But What They Can't Do Is Build a Plane'
The idea of [the terrorists'] strength is an illusion....The terrorists can fly a plane, but what they can't do is build a plane. What they can't do is build those towers.
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Miss_Faucie_Fishtits »

Nor do they want to. They can be at peace when nothing is grander or taller than themselves. Ideology doesn't drive terrorism, it is only a mask. The driver is always resentment, spurred by humiliation and being rendered so small by a civilisation that can build planes and towers.......
She irons her jeans, she's evil.........
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Re: On Ladders and Terrorists

Post by Mr. Perfect »

I dunno, a lot of terrorists come from rich families. Very few poor people become terrorists as a percentage.
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