Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
AzariLoveIran

Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by AzariLoveIran »

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questions raised whether Internet access is or should be a civil or human right

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Internet Access Is Not a Human Right

By VINTON G. CERF

Reston, Va.

FROM the streets of Tunis to Tahrir Square and beyond, protests around the world last year were built on the Internet and the many devices that interact with it. Though the demonstrations thrived because thousands of people turned out to participate, they could never have happened as they did without the ability that the Internet offers to communicate, organize and publicize everywhere, instantaneously.

It is no surprise, then, that the protests have raised questions about whether Internet access is or should be a civil or human right. The issue is particularly acute in countries whose governments clamped down on Internet access in an attempt to quell the protesters. In June, citing the uprisings in the Middle East and North Africa, a report by the United Nations’ special rapporteur went so far as to declare that the Internet had “become an indispensable tool for realizing a range of human rights.” Over the past few years, courts and parliaments in countries like France and Estonia have pronounced Internet access a human right.

But that argument, however well meaning, misses a larger point: technology is an enabler of rights, not a right itself. There is a high bar for something to be considered a human right. Loosely put, it must be among the things we as humans need in order to lead healthy, meaningful lives, like freedom from torture or freedom of conscience. It is a mistake to place any particular technology in this exalted category, since over time we will end up valuing the wrong things. For example, at one time if you didn’t have a horse it was hard to make a living. But the important right in that case was the right to make a living, not the right to a horse. Today, if I were granted a right to have a horse, I’m not sure where I would put it.

The best way to characterize human rights is to identify the outcomes that we are trying to ensure. These include critical freedoms like freedom of speech and freedom of access to information — and those are not necessarily bound to any particular technology at any particular time. Indeed, even the United Nations report, which was widely hailed as declaring Internet access a human right, acknowledged that the Internet was valuable as a means to an end, not as an end in itself.

What about the claim that Internet access is or should be a civil right? The same reasoning above can be applied here — Internet access is always just a tool for obtaining something else more important — though the argument that it is a civil right is, I concede, a stronger one than that it is a human right. Civil rights, after all, are different from human rights because they are conferred upon us by law, not intrinsic to us as human beings.

While the United States has never decreed that everyone has a “right” to a telephone, we have come close to this with the notion of “universal service” — the idea that telephone service (and electricity, and now broadband Internet) must be available even in the most remote regions of the country. When we accept this idea, we are edging into the idea of Internet access as a civil right, because ensuring access is a policy made by the government.

Yet all these philosophical arguments overlook a more fundamental issue: the responsibility of technology creators themselves to support human and civil rights. The Internet has introduced an enormously accessible and egalitarian platform for creating, sharing and obtaining information on a global scale. As a result, we have new ways to allow people to exercise their human and civil rights.

In this context, engineers have not only a tremendous obligation to empower users, but also an obligation to ensure the safety of users online. That means, for example, protecting users from specific harms like viruses and worms that silently invade their computers. Technologists should work toward this end.

It is engineers — and our professional associations and standards-setting bodies like the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers — that create and maintain these new capabilities. As we seek to advance the state of the art in technology and its use in society, we must be conscious of our civil responsibilities in addition to our engineering expertise.

Improving the Internet is just one means, albeit an important one, by which to improve the human condition. It must be done with an appreciation for the civil and human rights that deserve protection — without pretending that access itself is such a right.

Vinton G. Cerf, a fellow at the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers, is a vice president and chief Internet evangelist for Google.

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IMVHO, Internet access is a civil & human right


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Enki
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by Enki »

Well, the reality is that if you cannot access the internet you are a subject class that is subordinate to the whims of the classes that can use the internet. In otherwords, a slave.

But there are so many material goods that without which you live in impoverished slavelike conditions that we do not consider to be a human right.
Men often oppose a thing merely because they have had no agency in planning it, or because it may have been planned by those whom they dislike.
-Alexander Hamilton
crashtech

Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by crashtech »

I call it a "good," not a "right."

Luckily, it is in the interest of commerce to ensure everyone has access, so few extraordinary measures have been necessary to continue to bring Internet access to almost as many places as there is electricity.
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Enki
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by Enki »

crashtech wrote:I call it a "good," not a "right."

Luckily, it is in the interest of commerce to ensure everyone has access, so few extraordinary measures have been necessary to continue to bring Internet access to almost as many places as there is electricity.
Yes, absolutely. When my wife was up the Rio Negro in the Amazon out of Manaus, she saw how the locals were using cell phones. The towers were only placed along the river, but the people who took goods to market along the river had it so much better. It used to be that they would have to travel 3 weeks to Manaus to the markets make the deals, travel 3 weeks back, pack up the goods, travel three weeks back to Manaus to deliver the goods, then travel 3 weeks back home. Now they make the deals via cell phone and they only have to travel for delivery.

I don't really like the word, 'rights', because there are so many things we call 'inalienable rights' that can and are easily alienated by power. I have the right to life but I can be killed, I have the right to liberty but well the government doesn't take that one very seriously, and the pursuit of happiness is a subjective metaphysical that doesn't really mean anything other than it is florid language.
Men often oppose a thing merely because they have had no agency in planning it, or because it may have been planned by those whom they dislike.
-Alexander Hamilton
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Nonc Hilaire
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

Not a right, but a public utility.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

Teresa of Ávila
crashtech

Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by crashtech »

There is a fundamental disagreement regarding the definition of "rights" that will underlie any discussion of this nature. I see rights as demands an individual can reasonably make of life in civilized society that do not impinge on the rights of others. However, many people view rights also as an ever expanding set of entitlements that are provided (guaranteed, if you will) by the State.

In my view, while taxation justly provides for many of the infrastructure needs that give benefit to all, taxation that provides benefits explicitly to individuals is always morally suspect. Specifically in this case, I would see taxation to provide for communications infrastructure as something worth consideration, but taxation to specifically provide individuals with free Internet as morally wrong.
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Nonc Hilaire
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by Nonc Hilaire »

crashtech wrote:There is a fundamental disagreement regarding the definition of "rights" that will underlie any discussion of this nature. I see rights as demands an individual can reasonably make of life in civilized society that do not impinge on the rights of others. However, many people view rights also as an ever expanding set of entitlements that are provided (guaranteed, if you will) by the State.

In my view, while taxation justly provides for many of the infrastructure needs that give benefit to all, taxation that provides benefits explicitly to individuals is always morally suspect. Specifically in this case, I would see taxation to provide for communications infrastructure as something worth consideration, but taxation to specifically provide individuals with free Internet as morally wrong.
Well said.
“Christ has no body now but yours. Yours are the eyes through which he looks with compassion on this world. Yours are the feet with which he walks among His people to do good. Yours are the hands through which he blesses His creation.”

Teresa of Ávila
crashtech

Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by crashtech »

Thanks. What I like most about this forum is not only the opportunity to understand other points of view, but also to learn how to hone and articulate my own beliefs in a coherent way. Sometimes I do OK for a guy with no diplomas, and Internet access has played a large part in that.
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Zack Morris
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by Zack Morris »

A less contentious and more immediately relevant question: is an unregulated Internet a human right? Forget about the access part for a moment.
crashtech

Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by crashtech »

Certain aspects of regulation will no doubt run afoul of First Amendment concerns, but I think more regulation is coming. No, I don't think an unregulated Internet is a "right," and it's a harder sell that it is even a "good," though I personally think so.
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Zack Morris
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by Zack Morris »

crashtech wrote:Certain aspects of regulation will no doubt run afoul of First Amendment concerns, but I think more regulation is coming. No, I don't think an unregulated Internet is a "right," and it's a harder sell that it is even a "good," though I personally think so.
I have no doubt that regulation is coming but I would love an unfettered Internet to be a 'right'. The more egregious criminal activity on the Internet should already be covered by existing laws and I'm not too bothered by the other so-called 'problems' that the Wild West nature of the 'net has caused. Consider that most of these problems went away on their own without too much government intervention. There are better technical than legislative solutions to stop phishers and spammers, for instance.

Laws like SOPA are a serious problem. I'd rather err on the side of Internet freedom being a right than go down that rabbit hole.
crashtech

Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by crashtech »

Part of me agrees, but I don't think we get to go around making rights out of wants. I'm not sure how you would integrate the right to an unregulated Internet into the Bill of Rights, but I'm willing to watch you take a stab at it.
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Parodite
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by Parodite »

"Unregulated" does not exist.
Deep down I'm very superficial
Demon of Undoing
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by Demon of Undoing »

You don't have a right without sacrificing something. The inverse of it is no privacy- if everyone has a right to information, then everyone must let free access to information occur.

I can't tell what kind of underwear crashtech is wearing. It's a moral wrong for him to capture data and not release it- everyone has a right to the Internet/ all current data, correct? So there goes your privacy in the name of a demand for content.
crashtech

Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by crashtech »

Hell, I'm not even sure which underwear I'm wearing, as I got dressed in near total darkness this morning. I'm pretty sure they are boxer briefs, though.

So now I'm not sure if I have done my part for freedom, tyranny or just TMI.
noddy
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by noddy »

its is a "right" now in australia via the NBN and as with all government controlled rights say goodbye to competition and different vendors with different choices and say hello to centralised one-way-for-everyone at a government dictated cost with subsidies for the poor.... makes turning off blacklisted sites oh so much easier aswell as enforcing copyright law so that kiddies stop avoiding their jailtime... those evil private suppliers where not taking the job of prosecuting their customers seriously.

its playing out much the same as the alabama water supply - massively over infrastructured nonsense that will turn my $40 a month bill into a $100 a month bill.

apparently im too stupid to realise i cant currently participate in the new economy even though ive been living and working in it for a decade now.
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feck
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by feck »

Your $40 Internet connection was made possible and brought about by government subsidies.
noddy
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by noddy »

feck wrote:Your $40 Internet connection was made possible and brought about by government subsidies.
how so... i use wireless and thats private infrastructure as far as im aware.

do you mean the awful debacle of the socialised telecom becoming the frankenstein telstra ?
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noddy
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by noddy »

to answer the topic question, i do think everyone needs access to the internet and that can be done by via the upgrade of libraries and i dont think private industry was failing to provide extremely cheap options - basic smartphones with high speed data connections are only $30 a month.
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crashtech

Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by crashtech »

Yeah, this was one of those things where the market was working pretty damn good. Government involvement will only screw things up, and has already in Australia if I understand noddy right. We get 3 Mb plus an emergency land line for 50 bucks, not too shabby for out in the sticks, and afaik it's not nor ever has been "subsidized."
noddy
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by noddy »

the government tried and failed to get all the private suppliers to implement their blacklist filtering and also enforce their copyright agreements with the american big boys so anyone that isnt seeing the nationalisation of our infrastructure with that in mind isnt paying attention.

alas, thats a minority viewpoint and i dare say a magority of australians want highly filtered internet supplied to everyone ala TV... im pretty much resigned to it.

it is a requirement to participate in the modern world but like you i did not see the market failing to provide maximum options and many price points.
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feck
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by feck »

noddy wrote:to answer the topic question, i do think everyone needs access to the internet and that can be done by via the upgrade of libraries and i dont think private industry was failing to provide extremely cheap options - basic smartphones with high speed data connections are only $30 a month.

The Internet was created by taxpayer dollars and pretty much everyone's Internet is subsidized by taxpayers.



Australia is no different than any other more/less First World country:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/austral ... 5864859811
noddy
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by noddy »

feck wrote:
noddy wrote:to answer the topic question, i do think everyone needs access to the internet and that can be done by via the upgrade of libraries and i dont think private industry was failing to provide extremely cheap options - basic smartphones with high speed data connections are only $30 a month.

The Internet was created by taxpayer dollars and pretty much everyone's Internet is subsidized by taxpayers.



Australia is no different than any other more/less First World country:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/austral ... 5864859811
i dont think i ranted against subsidy nor help for the poor, i believe my rant is to do with centralised takeover as the only option for doing the former... specially when we already have a ppp (telstra) that is legally obliged to do the former.

anyway, not the place for this argument and i lost it in real political terms anyway unless the mad monk gets his way.
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feck
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by feck »

What is "A Right" anyway? Something a group of people allow themselves to do; usually expressed as a prohibition on an authority's actions.

I don't see where "Internet Access" and it's implied infrastructure falls under that rubric unless enough people agree and write it all down on a fancy piece of paper and then kill some people over it.
feck
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Re: Is Internet Access a Human Right ?

Post by feck »

Then you got yourself a right to Internet access.
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