On the Nature of Things | Forum

But Tinker congratulations on building the 1% economy, your work for the 1% will not go unnoticed. They really like it.

The 1% who benefit from you stuffing money in their pockets and the underclasses who give their opportunities away seem to love this transfer of wealth. The Tinker/Obama take from the poor and give to the rich. Well done Tinker.

http://washingtonexaminer.com/shock-pol ... le/2528621

President Obama's approval numbers are starting to mimic Mitt Romney's.

According to a new YouGov poll, it's the rich -- not the poor or middle class -- who back Obama more despite his 2012 campaign attacking the rich.

The poll for the Economist found that fewer than half of those with incomes less than $100,000 per year approve of Obama's performance, while he enjoys a 54 percent approval rating among those with incomes higher than that.

Those earning less than $40,000 a year disapprove of the president's performance, 51 percent to 45 percent. Those earning $40,000 to $100,000 disapprove by a rate of 50 percent to 48 percent.

"A largely jobless recovery coupled with a Quantitative-Easing-fueled stock market rally seems to earn more smiles from the upscale among us, fewer from the working class," said the pollsters.

Tinker, Zack Morris do you know why you guys on the left dislike minorities so much? I can't fathom it. Why don't you leave them alone?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/29/busin ... .html?_r=0

Millions of Americans suffered a loss of wealth during the recession and the sluggish recovery that followed. But the last half-decade has proved far worse for black and Hispanic families than for white families, starkly widening the already large gulf in wealth between non-Hispanic white Americans and most minority groups, according to a new study from the Urban Institute.

“It was already dismal,” Darrick Hamilton, a professor at the New School in New York, said of the wealth gap between black and white households. “It got even worse.”

Given the dynamics of the housing recovery and the rebound in the stock market, the wealth gap might still be growing, experts said, further dimming the prospects for economic advancement for current and future generations of Americans from minority groups.

We are leaving them alone. And this is what happened There aren't any big new government initiatives aimed at minorities and the existing ones, like affirmative action, have been on the way out for years now. The beauty of all this is that whatever your plan is, it doesn't involve government, so how come it can't compete with a government that quite literally does nothing for minorities?

Mr. Perfect wrote:

Enki wrote:

Zack Morris wrote:Obviously, you don't employ skilled workers, else you would realize that engineering/science/math/medical salaries are sky-high right now. For the engineering and science folks (and many studying math as well), graduate school is funded and research is salaried, meaning no accumulation of debt. And it isn't all government money -- I was funded entirely by the private sector, save for two research stints abroad, which were government-funded.

Zack Morris is correct.

Corporations were paying for engineers' college when I graduated. There is nothing new about it. Zack Morris is incorrect.

Ah but there is a difference. During the Mesozoic, when you were attending college, the proportion of foreign students being paid for advanced education in STEM fields was perhaps half or a bit more than today -- that's a factor of 10-20% of the total number of degrees awarded to both citizens and non-citizens. The free market, or whatever, made Americans decide that higher pay is undesirable, apparently, and now they're whining.

Zack Morris wrote: Ah but there is a difference. During the Mesozoic, when you were attending college, the proportion of foreign students being paid for advanced education in STEM fields was perhaps half or a bit more than today -- that's a factor of 10-20% of the total number of degrees awarded to both citizens and non-citizens. The free market, or whatever, made Americans decide that higher pay is undesirable, apparently, and now they're whining.

Incoherent.

Zack Morris wrote: Ah but there is a difference. During the Mesozoic, when you were attending college, the proportion of foreign students being paid for advanced education in STEM fields was perhaps half or a bit more than today -- that's a factor of 10-20% of the total number of degrees awarded to both citizens and non-citizens. The free market, or whatever, made Americans decide that higher pay is undesirable, apparently, and now they're whining.

Well of course no Zack Morris, as the article states subprime was aimed at minorities who were hardest hit by it, your idea, the private economy has been throttled taking away any opportunity of relief there, and you've given all the money to the investor class, people like me, instead of minorities. Why do that? And that's before we get to the drug war you unleashed on them, and all the blacks you locked up in jail.

What's with all the softballs?

if you ignore all the rhetoric and focus on outcomes then its much less confusing.

Mr. Perfect wrote: Well of course no Zack Morris, as the article states subprime was aimed at minorities who were hardest hit by it, your idea,

The housing bubble was inflated during a Republican administration that stressed an 'ownership society' and popped during that same administration. Why were minorities hardest hit? Why were they in such a precarious financial position to begin with? According to you, the systemic discrimination that occurred within living memory had absolutely nothing to do with their starting further behind in the race. Laughable.

the private economy has been throttled taking away any opportunity of relief there,

The skilled labor force is thriving here and abroad. Your idea of a thriving private sector is below-minimum-wage employment, which wouldn't provide any relief to those living on or above the minimum wage but who are still dirt poor. The simple fact is that unskilled labor can't sustain a modern economy. Setting up and running a business are as easy as ever but low-wage industries like burger-flipping, lawn care, and machining are saturated. We don't need any more of these things.

One thing that has been consistently absent from this discussion is your idea of where these people should be employed. Traditionally, the answer has been 'middle class occupations', but these have always existed in a precarious economic position, as evidenced by the absence of a thriving middle class throughout most of human history. The only time we have had such a thing is immediately after major technological revolutions and artificially after WWII when there were barriers preventing others from duplicating it. The service sector has been decimated by the Internet and was never robust enough to be economically self-sufficient in the first place.

Zack Morris wrote: The housing bubble was inflated during a Republican administration that stressed an 'ownership society' and popped during that same administration. Why were minorities hardest hit? Why were they in such a precarious financial position to begin with?

Because Democrats targeted them for it. Without subprime minorities would have had no exposure to the Keynesian RE bubble.

Gain some knowledge, if you are able.

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According to you, the systemic discrimination that occurred within living memory had absolutely nothing to do with their starting further behind in the race. Laughable.

Zack Morris, the minority communities have been the wards of the liberal Democrat party for over 40 years now, nigh on 50, and the result is record numbers of blacks in jail, the lowest academic results in modern history and the wealth gap between black and white being the largest in our known recorded history. Leave me out of it, I have nothing to do with it. It is entirely your affair.

The skilled labor force is thriving here and abroad. Your idea of a thriving private sector is below-minimum-wage employment, which wouldn't provide any relief to those living on or above the minimum wage but who are still dirt poor. The simple fact is that unskilled labor can't sustain a modern economy.

But Zack Morris the Democrat Party prides itself on being the party of the little guy, the poor unwashed, the party of public schools, the party of the union man, the party of the illegal immigrant not the party of the highly paid highly educated college boy. Trumka despises those people as do the Democrats back to FDR and earlier. Why do you despise your own people Zack Morris? Throw your own people to the dogs? Why destroy their ability to earn a living Zack Morris? What is the source of your misanthropy, do you figure?

Setting up and running a business are as easy as ever but low-wage industries like burger-flipping, lawn care, and machining are saturated. We don't need any more of these things.

But Zack Morris if such things are easier than ever why are they not being done? In your own words. You are in charge of the economy Zack Morris, why do you not provide jobs for these people?

Why is your party as their main legislative thrust trying bring in tens of millions of burger flippers and lawn mowers? Why are you doing that, in your own words.

One thing that has been consistently absent from this discussion is your idea of where these people should be employed. Traditionally, the answer has been 'middle class occupations', but these have always existed in a precarious economic position, as evidenced by the absence of a thriving middle class throughout most of human history. The only time we have had such a thing is immediately after major technological revolutions and artificially after WWII when there were barriers preventing others from duplicating it. The service sector has been decimated by the Internet and was never robust enough to be economically self-sufficient in the first place.

The question Zack Morris is what do you think your black people should be employed doing when you graduate them from high school at a rate of as low as 30%? When you do that what do you expect for them Zack Morris. In your own words.

A lot fewer people would have lost their homes if they had stipulated a fixed rate mortgage. The Variable Rate Mortgages screwed a lot of people. I am kind of wishing we'd bought during Subprime, we could've maintained our mortgage through that time.

Enki wrote:I tell everyone I run across who needs work to learn Javascript and Ruby on Rails.

Tell me what to make of this posting. Here's a quote:
"• Ideal candidate should have a minimum of 5 to 8 years of experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails."

Ruby on Rails version 1.0 was released in December 2005, which is less than 8 years ago. How exactly is someone supposed to have 8 years (or more) years of experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails if the product has only been around for 7.5 years? Are they expecting David Heinemeier Hansson (the guy who invented the platform) to apply for a 6-12 month contract position?

And if this is what they're looking for -- for a short term position -- what does someone who learned Ruby on Rails in their spare time -- but has no actual business experience or official academic experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails -- have to do to get a job?

Enki wrote:A lot fewer people would have lost their homes if they had stipulated a fixed rate mortgage. The Variable Rate Mortgages screwed a lot of people.

The people who took them generally did so because they couldn't afford the fixed rate. They may have figured that if worst came to worst and they couldn't afford to pay if the rate reset higher, they could always sell for considerably more than they paid. The people who took subprime and/or interest-only or less-than-interest loans are the same way, only more so. People were lied to about the real estate market, they lied on mortgage applications (or the broker who filled the forms out lied), they were lied to about the mortgages, foreign pension funds who bought mortgage-backed-securities were lied-to. There was a lot of fraud going on.

This happened because people wanted to be lied to.

I am kind of wishing we'd bought during Subprime, we could've maintained our mortgage through that time.

Possibly. But if you can buy now, I think that you ought to do it. Rates will eventually go higher.

the big boom in adhoc web development is passing because the polish and refinement on the big blog type engines and webstores has made most of the do-it-yourself redundant so small business that provided alot of the work for new coders isnt doing that anymore.

in the circles i travel most of the attention now is focused on app development for the smartphones and tablets and the web devel is more settled into larger on going projects for big players.

as for rates going higher - hard to say because in the current environment of increasing unemployment and decreasing purchasing power for the employed then it would cause a massive devaluation of the housing market if they made it harder to service loans... feedback loops on consumption et all.

they are trapped in a damned if you damned if you dont loop and the best outcome they are hoping for is a managed collapse of the previous 2 decades credit binge so any movements in interest rates will be minor until that has occured.

Azrael wrote:

Enki wrote:I tell everyone I run across who needs work to learn Javascript and Ruby on Rails.

Tell me what to make of this posting. Here's a quote:
"• Ideal candidate should have a minimum of 5 to 8 years of experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails."

Ruby on Rails version 1.0 was released in December 2005, which is less than 8 years ago. How exactly is someone supposed to have 8 years (or more) years of experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails if the product has only been around for 7.5 years? Are they expecting David Heinemeier Hansson (the guy who invented the platform) to apply for a 6-12 month contract position?

And if this is what they're looking for -- for a short term position -- what does someone who learned Ruby on Rails in their spare time -- but has no actual business experience or official academic experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails -- have to do to get a job?

It means that the Human Resources officer that wrote that post is an durian.

noddy wrote:the big boom in adhoc web development is passing because the polish and refinement on the big blog type engines and webstores has made most of the do-it-yourself redundant so small business that provided alot of the work for new coders isnt doing that anymore.

in the circles i travel most of the attention now is focused on app development for the smartphones and tablets and the web devel is more settled into larger on going projects for big players.

as for rates going higher - hard to say because in the current environment of increasing unemployment and decreasing purchasing power for the employed then it would cause a massive devaluation of the housing market if they made it harder to service loans... feedback loops on consumption et all.

they are trapped in a damned if you damned if you dont loop and the best outcome they are hoping for is a managed collapse of the previous 2 decades credit binge so any movements in interest rates will be minor until that has occured.

Here in New York if you go into a room full of techies and ask how many people work for a company that is hiring you get 60% or more hands up.

How many black people are getting hired.

Mr. Perfect wrote:.

How many black people are getting hired.

.

Have no numbers, but would bet the farm Blacks worst off since Obama took power




.

Az, you are like a prophet, look at these numbers. Obama been terrible for blacks. Blacks destroyed for generations to come.

Mr. Perfect wrote:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/29/busin ... .html?_r=0

Millions of Americans suffered a loss of wealth during the recession and the sluggish recovery that followed. But the last half-decade has proved far worse for black and Hispanic families than for white families, starkly widening the already large gulf in wealth between non-Hispanic white Americans and most minority groups, according to a new study from the Urban Institute.

“It was already dismal,” Darrick Hamilton, a professor at the New School in New York, said of the wealth gap between black and white households. “It got even worse.”

Given the dynamics of the housing recovery and the rebound in the stock market, the wealth gap might still be growing, experts said, further dimming the prospects for economic advancement for current and future generations of Americans from minority groups.

Enki wrote:A lot fewer people would have lost their homes if they had stipulated a fixed rate mortgage. The Variable Rate Mortgages screwed a lot of people. I am kind of wishing we'd bought during Subprime, we could've maintained our mortgage through that time.

And enjoyed 25% price depreciation.

Mr. Perfect wrote:How many black people are getting hired.

Black people learn to code in much lower proportions than whites, asians, jews, etc... But when they can code, there is no discrimination to speak of. Finding a good coder is tough, it's a seller's market.

We're working on potential web development classes at the library in Brooklyn to help us train developers from the local community. Maybe create a pipeline of new coders.

To be clear, the library we are talking about is in a majority black neighborhood...like more than 80% of people there are black.

Enki wrote:

Azrael wrote:

Enki wrote:I tell everyone I run across who needs work to learn Javascript and Ruby on Rails.

Tell me what to make of this posting. Here's a quote:
"• Ideal candidate should have a minimum of 5 to 8 years of experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails."

Ruby on Rails version 1.0 was released in December 2005, which is less than 8 years ago. How exactly is someone supposed to have 8 years (or more) years of experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails if the product has only been around for 7.5 years? Are they expecting David Heinemeier Hansson (the guy who invented the platform) to apply for a 6-12 month contract position?

And if this is what they're looking for -- for a short term position -- what does someone who learned Ruby on Rails in their spare time -- but has no actual business experience or official academic experience in developing applications using Ruby on Rails -- have to do to get a job?

It means that the Human Resources officer that wrote that post is an durian.

That's what I figured. HR is generally the last to know what's going on.

But does it mean anything else? Anything less obvious? Anything you might be aware of that those of us that don't have your background wouldn't notice?

noddy wrote:the big boom in adhoc web development is passing because the polish and refinement on the big blog type engines and webstores has made most of the do-it-yourself redundant so small business that provided alot of the work for new coders isnt doing that anymore.

That's what I thought. So what is good to know now?

in the circles i travel most of the attention now is focused on app development for the smartphones and tablets and the web devel is more settled into larger on going projects for big players.

I think that mobile payments may be a good field, but I think that, in general, there are way to many people making "me, too" apps.

as for rates going higher - hard to say because in the current environment of increasing unemployment and decreasing purchasing power for the employed then it would cause a massive devaluation of the housing market if they made it harder to service loans... feedback loops on consumption et all.

I agree. I think that rates will stay low for years.

they are trapped in a damned if you damned if you dont loop and the best outcome they are hoping for is a managed collapse of the previous 2 decades credit binge so any movements in interest rates will be minor until that has occured.

I think that there is already a slow motion collapse of the credit binge. Consumer debt is decreasing in the U.S.

If you are good with data learn SQL, Heroku, R, etc...

Data is the hot thing right now. It is where myself and many of many friends are making their money.

The internet is like contract work building a city, they need your specialty bad until it's built. For you Azrael I would recommend getting on the data analysis side, because you are a good researcher. That won't run out of work as quickly as the building side will.

I am hoping the product we are building will make some money so I can be on the investment side.

Business Intelligence is also hot. Natural Language Processing is the next big thing. Sentiment analysis will be huge forward the end of the decade.

Thanks, Enki. That sounds like very good advice.