On the Nature of Things | Forum

Typhoon wrote:

Ibrahim wrote:

noddy wrote:nice it didnt affect you too much tinker.

i cheerfully note that much of our reportage was cocksizing it against our monster cyclone yasi of last year.

Sounds about right. I wonder if the Japanese media has been doing the same re: their tsunami. And of course Sandy killed more Caribbeans than Americans.

Comparing a hurricane to a earthquake + tsunami does not make sense.

Typhoons are an annual event in Japan. Loss of life sometimes occurs due to accidents, flooding, and mudslides.

The reporting has been mainly factual: NHK | Superstorm Sandy leaves 42 dead, many powerless

Ill certainly agree that comparing disasters does not make sense, which of course doesn't stop people from doing it.

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' Iran offers to send aid to Sandy victims in NY '


Obama should accept Iranian aid to Sandy Victims


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Roger Pielke: Hurricanes and Human Choice

Sandy was terrible, but we're currently in a relative hurricane 'drought.'
Connecting energy policy and disasters makes little scientific sense.

To put things into even starker perspective, consider that from August 1954 through August 1955,
the East Coast saw three different storms make landfall—Carol, Hazel and Diane—that in 2012 each would have caused about twice as much damage as Sandy.

Typhoon wrote:Roger Pielke: Hurricanes and Human Choice

Sandy was terrible, but we're currently in a relative hurricane 'drought.'
Connecting energy policy and disasters makes little scientific sense.

To put things into even starker perspective, consider that from August 1954 through August 1955,
the East Coast saw three different storms make landfall—Carol, Hazel and Diane—that in 2012 each would have caused about twice as much damage as Sandy.

Oh really? It doesn't make sense to have the power infrastructure meet standards like, "don't blow up during a hurricane."???

Enki wrote:

Typhoon wrote:Roger Pielke: Hurricanes and Human Choice

Sandy was terrible, but we're currently in a relative hurricane 'drought.'
Connecting energy policy and disasters makes little scientific sense.

To put things into even starker perspective, consider that from August 1954 through August 1955,
the East Coast saw three different storms make landfall—Carol, Hazel and Diane—that in 2012 each would have caused about twice as much damage as Sandy.

Oh really? It doesn't make sense to have the power infrastructure meet standards like, "don't blow up during a hurricane."???

More like don't build 10,000 offshore windmills that will be swept away.

As for hardening the power infrastructure against hurricanes, that's a cost-benefit analysis.

I'm a fan of replace old style nuclear power plants with power generation that won't level a city if it is damaged by a Tsunami, myself. And don't misconstrue that as being anti-nuclear. I could be said to be anti-1960s nuclear though.

Enki wrote:I'm a fan of replace old style nuclear power plants with power generation that won't level a city if it is damaged by a Tsunami, myself. And don't misconstrue that as being anti-nuclear. I could be said to be anti-1960s nuclear though.

I would argue that that is reasonable.
The current civilian lwr designs are a commercialization of military reactors far better suited to nuclear submarines and plutonium production.

Typhoon wrote:

Enki wrote:I'm a fan of replace old style nuclear power plants with power generation that won't level a city if it is damaged by a Tsunami, myself. And don't misconstrue that as being anti-nuclear. I could be said to be anti-1960s nuclear though.

I would argue that that is reasonable. The current civilian lwr designs are a commercialization of military reactors far better suited to nuclear submarines and plutonium production.

Thank you VERY Much for your post, Typhoon.

Seconded.

I would recommend having a CANDU attitude ..........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CANDU_reactor

PyohW9rYEKc

Typhoon wrote:

Enki wrote:I'm a fan of replace old style nuclear power plants with power generation that won't level a city if it is damaged by a Tsunami, myself. And don't misconstrue that as being anti-nuclear. I could be said to be anti-1960s nuclear though.

I would argue that that is reasonable.
The current civilian lwr designs are a commercialization of military reactors far better suited to nuclear submarines and plutonium production.

There are too many nuclear power plants within reach of NYC that if they went Fukushima we'd have an economic disaster of unprecedented proportions. The thing that really roiled my stomach was when I heard about the Oyster Beach (Bay?) power plant in New Jersey. After just watching video of the transformers exploding at the steam plant on 14th street that made me pretty nervous. I'm glad to know that the steam plant was just transformers and that the nuclear plant seems to be ok, but damn...that was the only thing that really made me wonder if I needed to start thinking about heading to Texas.

Tinker, you guys in the NE are collectively kinda acting like a bunch of whiney bitches about this. "ooohh I had to wait in line for three hours for my Latte Macchiato."

This was a CATEGORY ONE storm -- you people would be catatonic if you had to go through what Houston just dealt with a couple of years ago. I'm reading that non union volunteers were turned away? What? Where would the infrastructure in Manhattan be if you took a direct hit from not only a CAT 1 storm, but something like Ike??

What the genuflect kinda bubble are you guys living in over there? Maybe we have an infrastructure problem? Are unprepared for this at bordering on New Orleans levels of negligence?


Oh, and to really piss you off: Fukushima still isn't as deadly as producing the same amount of energy using coal.

Yukon Cornelius wrote:Tinker, you guys in the NE are collectively kinda acting like a bunch of whiney bitches about this. "ooohh I had to wait in line for three hours for my Latte Macchiato."

This was a CATEGORY ONE storm -- you people would be catatonic if you had to go through what Houston just dealt with a couple of years ago. I'm reading that non union volunteers were turned away? What? Where would the infrastructure in Manhattan be if you took a direct hit from not only a CAT 1 storm, but something like Ike??

What the genuflect kinda bubble are you guys living in over there? Maybe we have an infrastructure problem? Are unprepared for this at bordering on New Orleans levels of negligence?

Aren't the people complaining mostly the ones with no power, flooded/burned homes, or dead family members?

Actually it's all the "OMG there's a TREE blocking my driveway -- *SNIFF* -- and no internet, I can ONLY get cell phone coverage and it's spotty" tweets.

The one that pushed things over the edge was the "It's been three days and I'm starting to worry about the contents of my wine fridge." I tweeted back that they might just put the wine OUTSIDE.


But hey, nevermind, the Marathon's on Sunday. NY just dodged a bullet, and they're worried about what would be a busy April weekend in the tornado belt. Every year.

Yukon Cornelius wrote:Actually it's all the "OMG there's a TREE blocking my driveway -- *SNIFF* -- and no internet, I can ONLY get cell phone coverage and it's spotty" tweets.

The one that pushed things over the edge was the "It's been three days and I'm starting to worry about the contents of my wine fridge." I tweeted back that they might just put the wine OUTSIDE.


But hey, nevermind, the Marathon's on Sunday. NY just dodged a bullet, and they're worried about what would be a busy April weekend in the tornado belt. Every year.

You cannot be serious. Whole neighborhoods burned to the ground, one borough practically washed away, a power plant that exploded, people cannot get from one end of the city to the other.

As someone who has actually FLOWN in a tornado, I have to call total bullshit. You need to get out and read the genuflecting news stat.

This is one of the most ignorant posts I've ever read.

I ain't complaining about lavender, the only thing I can't do is travel to Brooklyn. I didn't get touched by the hurricane at all.

Here's some keywords for the person who didn't even read the thread he posted in.

Breezy Point, Gerritsen Beach, Red Hook, Far Rockaway, Lower-East Side.

It's quite a bit more than not having power for iPhones and being unable to order a Machiatto.

The lady who had her two sons ripped from her arms when she tried to get out of her vehicle after she was told to evacuate and she got stuck in the storm surge, she should just suck it up and be self-reliant like an Alaskan.

Yes: Whole neighborhoods burned to the ground, one borough practically washed away, a power plant that exploded, people cannot get from one end of the city to the other.

...but the Marathon will run. That wont take any manpower off the recovery efforts. How bad is this, again?

And one more thing ----> sorry but, that's all I've gotten from the personal experience of apparently abnormally large number of NE people I follow on Twitter. So talk to them about their wine fridges.

And quite frankly you people out East do this every single time there's storm. It's the end of the f!cking world. The rest of us regularly weather several wind storms (even snow storms, where real snow comes out of the sky and falls on the ground) a year, without expecting to be the center of the world's attention.

How about some indignation for your crap infrastructure? You guys are going to fool around and end up worse than New Orleans. What would have happened if this was a direct hit?

Yukon Cornelius wrote:Yes: Whole neighborhoods burned to the ground, one borough practically washed away, a power plant that exploded, people cannot get from one end of the city to the other.

...but the Marathon will run. That wont take any manpower off the recovery efforts. How bad is this, again?

Yep, and people are pissed off about it.

Yukon Cornelius wrote:And one more thing ----> sorry but, that's all I've gotten from the personal experience of apparently abnormally large number of NE people I follow on Twitter. So talk to them about their wine fridges.

And quite frankly you people out East do this every single time there's storm. It's the end of the f!cking world. The rest of us regularly weather several wind storms (even snow storms, where real snow comes out of the sky and falls on the ground) a year, without expecting to be the center of the world's attention.

How about some indignation for your crap infrastructure? You guys are going to fool around and end up worse than New Orleans.

You do realize that we have damage that is the equivalent of Juneau burning down right?

Enki wrote:
Yep, and people are pissed off about it.

And that's the point, maybe these people need to climb down out of their ivory towers out on Long Island and smell the hypocrisy. NY is not ready for so much as a CAT 1 storm.

Yukon Cornelius wrote:

Enki wrote:
Yep, and people are pissed off about it.

And that's the point, maybe these people need to climb down out of their ivory towers out on Long Island and smell the hypocrisy. NY is not ready for so much as a CAT 1 storm.

And how would you propose that NY prepare itself for 14 foot storm surges?

I love how you're saying what I would classify as 'well duh' as though it's sage advice.

No, New York is not prepared for that for which there is no precedent. Repeating 'category 1 storm' is not even wrong. What did the damage here was the massive flooding.

Enki wrote:You do realize that we have damage that is the equivalent of Juneau burning down right?

You're trying to shift this to the people who actually suffered. I'm talking about people going O Solo Mio becuase they have tree in their driveway and have to go to Starbucks to get wifi.

Yukon Cornelius wrote:

Enki wrote:You do realize that we have damage that is the equivalent of Juneau burning down right?

You're trying to shift this to the people who actually suffered. I'm talking about people going O Solo Mio becuase they have tree in their driveway and have to go to Starbucks to get wifi.

Yeah, I am not giving two shits about them. You let them have the time-share in your mind. I don't give a lavender. And since posting a complaint to twitter takes all of three seconds I don't even think it matters. Let them complain about their wine, who cares?

Enki wrote:
And how would you propose that NY prepare itself for 14 foot storm surges?...

How was NO supposed to have prepared?

And I am talking about the flooding [storm surge.] Maybe you're just skimming my posts.

Oh, and Fukushima is still safer than producing the same energy with coal.