The approaching Honduran migrant caravan

[Mr. Perfect]

Social conservatives will never allow this, which is one of the reasons am such a reluctant Republican. Personal responsibility and freedom are their buzzwords, EXCEPT when it comes to things like adults imbibing intoxicants or having the wrong kind of consensual sex. Suddenly then they need to be everyone's babysitter.

That is sort of from a while ago. Internet pornography exploded under Bush and they didn't do anything about it.

[Mr. Perfect]

Unsupported assertion.

If you get to do it you have to let other people do it.

Demand creates its own supply.

Massive demand creates it own massive supply.

Is that how it works in Japan.

Personally I hold the view that if you decide to sell drugs the responsibility is entirely yours, or if you are a public official who looks the other way if criminals pay you then that is entirely your responsibility, etc.

[crashtech66]

...Personally I hold the view that if you decide to sell drugs the responsibility is entirely yours, or if you are a public official who looks the other way if criminals pay you then that is entirely your responsibility, etc.

Just curious what such responsibility entails, and if you are willing to apply your belief more globally, eg:

"...if you decide to sell a product the responsibility is entirely yours..."

Most true conservative favor product liability reform, meaning more personal responsibility and less finger-pointing.

[Mr. Perfect]

I think every action you take is your responsibility. What was your question exactly.

[crashtech66]

I think every action you take is your responsibility. What was your question exactly.

Could we stipulate that generally speaking, conservatives hold that someone selling a product is responsible for representing it accurately and for its quality, but the consumer is responsible for any injury that results from the product's improper use?

[Mr. Perfect]

Sure.

[Typhoon]

Unsupported assertion.

If you get to do it you have to let other people do it.

Wrong. Re Fox News link about.

Demand creates its own supply.

Massive demand creates it own massive supply.

Is that how it works in Japan.

Cultural difference. Being charged with dealing or possession brings shame and consequences not only to the individual, but the individual's family.
You get busted for dealing, your father's employer finds out, your father loses his job.

Illegal drug use is a cultural taboo, demand is much lower than in N Am. Better to get drunk and/or have a smoke.

Personally I hold the view that if you decide to sell drugs the responsibility is entirely yours, or if you are a public official who looks the other way if criminals pay you then that is entirely your responsibility, etc.

Sure. However, the so-called war on drugs has been an abject failure by any measure.

[Miss_Faucie_Fishtits]

I didn’t grow up in a South American country, but the culture rhymes. I think I told before of the father of a friend who, when I was fourteen, informed me that the Portuguese would have invented/produced much better computers than IBM if “the US let us.” I tried to figure out what the US was doing to hold back this powerhouse of Portuguese computing and got a confused story about not being allowed to grow rice and if Portugal did something or other (search me. It made no sense then, and I have trouble remembering insane ramblings) the US would cut aid. Thereby making it impossible for Portugal to have a computer industry.

In the years to follow, I heard similar stories about pretty much everything.

None of it was the fault of the (then) 48 official holidays a year, the culture of the 2 hour lunch and the hourly coffee, and of considering a job a sinecure from which it’s very hard to fire anyone; the laid-back Mediterranean lifestyle; the cultural disdain for people who work too hard; the socially conformist culture that makes it hard to invent or innovate; the lack of secure property rights; the socialist policies that stood astride the economy yelling “stop.” No, America had more than Portugal did, and produced more than Portugal did, so it was all America’s fault.

https://pjmedia.com/trending/dear-ameri ... st-hearts/

[Simple Minded]

https://pjmedia.com/trending/dear-ameri ... st-hearts/

Excellent article LG. Thanks for posting. Don't know how many times I heard my Yurp friends express their white guilt.

That why I love the question "How many are you going to take into your home?" It makes it personal. "We" is an imaginary concept for most. "Me" is reality.

Even Horge Ramos refused to answer the question.

[Typhoon]

. . .

https://pjmedia.com/trending/dear-ameri ... st-hearts/

All who have served the Revolution have plowed the sea.

~ Simón José Antonio de la Santísima Trinidad Bolívar Palacios Ponte y Blanco a.k.a. Bolívar

The article makes some good points*.

Yes, individuals and nations, in the end, are responsible for their own success or misery.

While the US has historically meddled extensively in Central and South America, it is no excuse.

The black market opportunities that the US affords have helped to make a bad situation worse.

*Anecdotally, there was a large Latin American contingent, mostly Brazilian, where I worked in the US Midwest.
All were highly educated, involved in post-graduate work.
They were there on the US govt's - taxpayer's dime, yet were absurdly critical of everything about the US.

[Simple Minded]

https://americanaffairsjournal.org/2018 ... n-borders/

[noddy]

good article.

in australia the left is quite torn on this issue - its the remnants of the unionised labourers that are most stridently anti immigration, the right wing is mostly pro business, pro cheap labour, pro upwards pressure on house prices, thusly pro immigration.

[Doc]

. . .

https://pjmedia.com/trending/dear-ameri ... st-hearts/

All who have served the Revolution have plowed the sea.

~ Simón José Antonio de la Santísima Trinidad Bolívar Palacios Ponte y Blanco a.k.a. Bolívar

The article makes some good points*.

Yes, individuals and nations, in the end, are responsible for their own success or misery.

While the US has historically meddled extensively in Central and South America, it is no excuse.

The black market opportunities that the US affords have helped to make a bad situation worse.

*Anecdotally, there was a large Latin American contingent, mostly Brazilian, where I worked in the US Midwest.
All were highly educated, involved in post-graduate work.
They were there on the US govt's - taxpayer's dime, yet were absurdly critical of everything about the US.

I have a Palestinian Friend married to an American women. He always complains that he always has to defend American women with other Arabs that keep saying that all American women are whores. The larger part of those Arabs studied in the US on the American tax payer's dime as well.

[Ammianus]

There are many things that should be said about this migrant issue. I will let loose with the first, most obvious one:

The American MSM is nothing less than the Lügenpresse when it comes to this. Just barely a month ago they were bloviating and fully gaslighting about Trump the Bumbling, Paranoid Liar when he warned about the multiple caravans. Viewers keep getting reassurances that those caravans are "thousands" of miles away from the border, and worrying about them means you're a racist crank. Now the MSM has the gall to cry about "chemical weapons" being used and the "humanitarian crisis" at our doorsteps.

Lügenpresse. Total Lügenpresse.

[Simple Minded]

good article.

in australia the left is quite torn on this issue - its the remnants of the unionised labourers that are most stridently anti immigration, the right wing is mostly pro business, pro cheap labour, pro upwards pressure on house prices, thusly pro immigration.

based on your posts about left and right, I think the lefties turning into righties, and the righties turning into lefties are about 20 years out of sync between Merka and Straya.

Being continually virtuous gets one no brownie points with the herd.

A complete reversal of the meaning of terms every generation seems to be the par over here. Have you noticed the same over there?

I think the author made some very obvious points, points that average Joes have been talking about for years, even decades. But yet the two governing parties of supposedly different ideologies never bring the obvious points into the national discussion. Neither side articulates any ideas of value. No wall is needed, simply make it illegal to hire illegal aliens. Fine employers who do so heavily. Decades ago, I knew Americans who lived in Canada, and they said trying to get a job in Canada as a "landed immigrant" was almost impossible. That may have changed in Canada, but US immigration law, and the refusal to enforce it is a joke.

"
Open borders has no public mandate, but immigration policies that place the burden of enforcement on employers instead of migrants do attract overwhelming support. According to a survey by the Washington Post and ABC News, support for mandating use of the federal employment verification system (E-Verify), which would prevent employers from exploiting illegal labor, is at nearly 80 percent—more than double the support for building a wall along the Mexican border.11 So why do presidential campaigns revolve around building a vast border wall? Why do current migration debates revolve around controversial ICE tactics to target migrants—especially when the more humane and popular method of placing the burden on employers to hire legal labor in the first place is also the most effective?12 The answer, in short, is that business lobbies have been blocking and sabotaging efforts like E-Verify for decades, while the open-borders Left has abandoned any serious discussion of these issues.

Recently, the Western Growers Association and California Farm Bureau Federation, among others, blocked a bill that would have made E-Verify mandatory, despite several pro-business concessions.13 Democrats seemed totally absent from this debate. As a result, workers from economies devastated by U.S. agriculture will continue to be invited in with the promise of work in order to be cheaply and illegally exploited. Lacking full legal rights, these noncitizens will be impossible to unionize and will be kept in constant fear of being arrested and criminalized.

It has now become a common slogan among advocates of open borders—and many mainstream commentators—that “there is no migrant crisis.” But whether they like it or not, radically transformative levels of mass migration are unpopular across every section of society and throughout the world. And the people among whom it is unpopular, the citizenry, have the right to vote. Thus migration increasingly presents a crisis that is fundamental to democracy. Any political party wishing to govern will either have to accept the will of the people, or it will have to repress dissent in order to impose the open borders agenda. Many on the libertarian Left are among the most aggressive advocates of the latter.

The immigration expansionists have two key weapons. One is the big business and financial interests all working on their side, but an equally powerful weapon—wielded more expertly by the left-leaning immigration expansionists—is moral blackmail and public shame.

[Simple Minded]

There are many things that should be said about this migrant issue. I will let loose with the first, most obvious one:

The American MSM is nothing less than the Lugenpresse when it comes to this. Just barely a month ago they were bloviating and fully gaslighting about Trump the Bumbling, Paranoid Liar when he warned about the multiple caravans. Viewers keep getting reassurances that those caravans are "thousands" of miles away from the border, and worrying about them means you're a racist crank. Now the MSM has the gall to cry about "chemical weapons" being used and the "humanitarian crisis" at our doorsteps.

Lugenpress. Total Lugenpresse.

True enough. Last week I heard Limbaugh re-state one of his previous predictions.

"The MSM will do everything in its power to portray the border between the US and Mexico as the border between Israel and the West Bank."

One sees so many video of people climbing and sitting on top of the border wall.
Removing morality from the conversation for the moment. (Feeble attempt to deflect the arrows of virtue signaling - Ed) It would be interesting to see the reaction, from both the public and the MSM if a simple "Shoot to kill anyone who attempts to climb on or over the wall!" order was given.

Not something I am advocating for obvious reasons.

I'm sure there are many who would be willing to test the resolve of the border guards with guns, even if it cost them their lives. I'm also sure that most guards would not trust the US government to protect them when they simply followed the orders they were given.

Power without the will to use it, is quickly recognized as not being power at all.

[Miss_Faucie_Fishtits]

Now..... that title is a bit much:

But the question is cogent.......



Why are those kids half-naked and in diapers?

As a one-time self respecting five-year old, that's egregious humiliation. Diapers are for babies and that guy standing in the background with a tripod suggests this vignette is staged.....

[Doc]

There are many things that should be said about this migrant issue. I will let loose with the first, most obvious one:

The American MSM is nothing less than the Lügenpresse when it comes to this. Just barely a month ago they were bloviating and fully gaslighting about Trump the Bumbling, Paranoid Liar when he warned about the multiple caravans. Viewers keep getting reassurances that those caravans are "thousands" of miles away from the border, and worrying about them means you're a racist crank. Now the MSM has the gall to cry about "chemical weapons" being used and the "humanitarian crisis" at our doorsteps.

Lügenpresse. Total Lügenpresse.

True enough. Last week I heard Limbaugh re-state one of his previous predictions.

"The MSM will do everything in its power to portray the border between the US and Mexico as the border between Israel and the West Bank."

One sees so many video of people climbing and sitting on top of the border wall.
Removing morality from the conversation for the moment. (Feeble attempt to deflect the arrows of virtue signaling - Ed) It would be interesting to see the reaction, from both the public and the MSM if a simple "Shoot to kill anyone who attempts to climb on or over the wall!" order was given.

Not something I am advocating for obvious reasons.

I'm sure there are many who would be willing to test the resolve of the border guards with guns, even if it cost them their lives. I'm also sure that most guards would not trust the US government to protect them when they simply followed the orders they were given.

Power without the will to use it, is quickly recognized as not being power at all.

It seems Rush wasn't thinking big enough

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/a ... i-germany/

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Likens Caravan to Jews Fleeing Nazi Germany

[Doc]

Now..... that title is a bit much:

But the question is cogent.......



Why are those kids half-naked and in diapers?

As a one-time self respecting five-year old, that's egregious humiliation. Diapers are for babies and that guy standing in the background with a tripod suggests this vignette is staged.....

The same though occurred to me about the diapers. The picture was apparently staged.

[Mr. Perfect]

This is what everyone voted for. Elections have consequences.

[Simple Minded]

It seems Rush wasn't thinking big enough

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/a ... i-germany/

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Likens Caravan to Jews Fleeing Nazi Germany

.

Jews fleeing NAZI Germany towards the US where Trump is Hitler!

I don't think I have ever heard any politician make an intelligent statement regarding the border and illegal immigration.

[noddy]

thats a whole bunch of irony in so many layers my cynicism is having trouble unpacking it.

[Simple Minded]

thats a whole bunch of irony in so many layers my cynicism is having trouble unpacking it.

C'mon mate, I know you can do it. Make the effort. Peel that onion!

"Dig within. There lies the wellspring of good. Ever dig, and it will ever flow." - Marcus Aurelius

[Simple Minded]

more food for irony:

HwAnqPoYdSg

Still, in the US, no republicans are talking about the caravan....... only the Tri-POTUS. I think Angela Nagle (author of The Left Case against Open Borders) was right. Politicians on both sides don't want to deal with the illegal immigration issue because they have been bought off by lobbyists.

[Simple Minded]

more food for those with an irony deficiency, or irony-poor blood:

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/artic ... 38778.html