NapLajoieonSteroids wrote: ↑Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:58 am
Ah, but the problem with single systems is that they don't work until a Great Khan type comes along and forces the issue by persuasive means.
So does this give the United States carte blanche to expand down into Panama and not just push them around in the usual ways?
right. we dont have a great khan and dont want one, so what we will get is a fracturing down into smaller coherant groups of people who do have the will to draw a boundary.
america does have carte blanche to do that but doesnt have the will... and on a pragmatic level doesnt want the responsiblity of more ungratefuls to look after.
china has the will, hence tibet, mongolia, nepal are all fair game.
NapLajoieonSteroids wrote: ↑Mon Mar 29, 2021 3:30 am
For all these difficult conversations we can multiply; the elephant in the room is that racialist obsession is an intellectual's disease as much as gluttony is a disease of the affluent.
The people in the room for the conversations are the people who want the conversations to begin with.
And the real nastiness parts of racial animosity always, always, always are stirred by these classes.
No one but an intellectual could marinate themselves so long in what 99% of the time amounts to "your mother" tier of insults.
But when there is conflagration, the finger never ever points in that direction.
yeh, the scammers and hustlers are dominating the public space.
"I fancied myself as some kind of god....It is a sort of disease when you consider yourself some kind of god, the creator of everything, but I feel comfortable about it now since I began to live it out.” -- George Soros
noddy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:50 am
claims are for the chattering class.
reality is numbers and the will to ignore the status quo.
another angle on this - what is attractive about white middle class culture as presented in the mediasphere right now - if it was a fresh off the boat immigrant, or a slave descendant, or some other "out group" .. what is it that makes me want to become part of it.
grumpy reactionary conservatives with a one eye rosy view of the 50's who constantly bang on about judeo christian superiority ?
loony lefties with a seeming obsession with genitals and change for changes sake ?
where is that solid, confident core that even creates a space for someone to want to be it, who represents it, what is that symbol.
“The West is a civilization that has survived all the prophecies of its collapse with a singular stratagem. Just as the bourgeoisie had to deny itself as a class in order to permit the bourgeoisification of society as a whole, from the worker to the baron; just as capital had to sacrifice itself as a wage relation in order to impose itself as a social relation – becoming cultural capital and health capital in addition to finance capital; just as Christianity had to sacrifice itself as a religion in order to survive as an affective structure – as a vague injunction to humility, compassion, and weakness; so the West has sacrificed itself as a particular civilization in order to impose itself as a universal culture. The operation can be summarized like this: an entity in its death throes sacrifices itself as a content in order to survive as a form.”
“There is no “clash of civilizations.” There is a clinically dead civilization kept alive by all sorts of life-support machines that spread a peculiar plague into the planet’s atmosphere. At this point it can no longer believe in a single one of its own “values,” and any affirmation of them is considered an impudent act, a provocation that should and must be taken apart, deconstructed, and returned to a state of doubt. Today Western imperialism is the imperialism of relativism, of the “it all depends on your point of view”; it is the eye-rolling or the wounded indignation at anyone who is stupid, primitive, or presumptuous enough to still believe in something, to affirm anything at all. You can see the dogmatism of constant questioning give its complicit wink of the eye everywhere in the universities and among the literary intelligentsias. No critique is too radical among postmodernist thinkers, as long as it maintains this total absence of certitude. A century ago, scandal was identified with any particularly unruly and raucous negation, while today it’s found in any affirmation that fails to tremble.
No social order can securely found itself on the principle that nothing is true. Yet it must be made secure. Applying the concept of “security” to everything these days is the expression of a project to securely fasten onto places, behaviours, and even people themselves, an ideal order to which they are no longer ready to submit. Saying “nothing is true” says nothing about the world but everything about the Western concept of truth. For the West, truth is not an attribute of beings or things, but of their representation. A representation that conforms to experience is held to be true. Science is, in the last analysis, this empire of universal verification. Since all human behaviour, from the most ordinary to the most learned, is based on a foundation of unevenly formulated presuppositions, and since all practices start from a point where things and their representations can no longer be distinguished, a dose of truth that the Western concept knows nothing about enters into every life. We talk in the West about “real people,” but only in order to mock these simpletons. This is why Westerners have always been thought of as liars and hypocrites by the people they have colonised. This is why they are envied for what they have, for their technological development, but never for what they are, for which they are rightly held in contempt. Sade, Nietzsche and Artaud wouldn’t be taught in schools if the kind of truth mentioned above was not discredited in advance. Containing all affirmations and deactivating all certainties as they irresistibly come to light-such is the long labour of the Western intellect. The police and philosophy are two convergent, if formally distinct, means to this end.”
noddy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:50 am
grumpy reactionary conservatives with a one eye rosy view of the 50's
Who are these reactionary conservatives who love the 50s? Most of them are resting under our feet by now because the 1950s were a long time ago.
But that it takes up so much head space in this conversations means it must have been a very prosperous time...so prosperous its still attracting immigrants.
noddy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:50 am
claims are for the chattering class.
reality is numbers and the will to ignore the status quo.
another angle on this - what is attractive about white middle class culture as presented in the mediasphere right now - if it was a fresh off the boat immigrant, or a slave descendant, or some other "out group" .. what is it that makes me want to become part of it.
grumpy reactionary conservatives with a one eye rosy view of the 50's who constantly bang on about judeo christian superiority ?
loony lefties with a seeming obsession with genitals and change for changes sake ?
where is that solid, confident core that even creates a space for someone to want to be it, who represents it, what is that symbol.
“The West is a civilization that has survived all the prophecies of its collapse with a singular stratagem. Just as the bourgeoisie had to deny itself as a class in order to permit the bourgeoisification of society as a whole, from the worker to the baron; just as capital had to sacrifice itself as a wage relation in order to impose itself as a social relation – becoming cultural capital and health capital in addition to finance capital; just as Christianity had to sacrifice itself as a religion in order to survive as an affective structure – as a vague injunction to humility, compassion, and weakness; so the West has sacrificed itself as a particular civilization in order to impose itself as a universal culture. The operation can be summarized like this: an entity in its death throes sacrifices itself as a content in order to survive as a form.”
“There is no “clash of civilizations.” There is a clinically dead civilization kept alive by all sorts of life-support machines that spread a peculiar plague into the planet’s atmosphere. At this point it can no longer believe in a single one of its own “values,” and any affirmation of them is considered an impudent act, a provocation that should and must be taken apart, deconstructed, and returned to a state of doubt. Today Western imperialism is the imperialism of relativism, of the “it all depends on your point of view”; it is the eye-rolling or the wounded indignation at anyone who is stupid, primitive, or presumptuous enough to still believe in something, to affirm anything at all. You can see the dogmatism of constant questioning give its complicit wink of the eye everywhere in the universities and among the literary intelligentsias. No critique is too radical among postmodernist thinkers, as long as it maintains this total absence of certitude. A century ago, scandal was identified with any particularly unruly and raucous negation, while today it’s found in any affirmation that fails to tremble.
No social order can securely found itself on the principle that nothing is true. Yet it must be made secure. Applying the concept of “security” to everything these days is the expression of a project to securely fasten onto places, behaviours, and even people themselves, an ideal order to which they are no longer ready to submit. Saying “nothing is true” says nothing about the world but everything about the Western concept of truth. For the West, truth is not an attribute of beings or things, but of their representation. A representation that conforms to experience is held to be true. Science is, in the last analysis, this empire of universal verification. Since all human behaviour, from the most ordinary to the most learned, is based on a foundation of unevenly formulated presuppositions, and since all practices start from a point where things and their representations can no longer be distinguished, a dose of truth that the Western concept knows nothing about enters into every life. We talk in the West about “real people,” but only in order to mock these simpletons. This is why Westerners have always been thought of as liars and hypocrites by the people they have colonised. This is why they are envied for what they have, for their technological development, but never for what they are, for which they are rightly held in contempt. Sade, Nietzsche and Artaud wouldn’t be taught in schools if the kind of truth mentioned above was not discredited in advance. Containing all affirmations and deactivating all certainties as they irresistibly come to light-such is the long labour of the Western intellect. The police and philosophy are two convergent, if formally distinct, means to this end.”
noddy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:50 am
claims are for the chattering class.
reality is numbers and the will to ignore the status quo.
another angle on this - what is attractive about white middle class culture as presented in the mediasphere right now - if it was a fresh off the boat immigrant, or a slave descendant, or some other "out group" .. what is it that makes me want to become part of it.
grumpy reactionary conservatives with a one eye rosy view of the 50's who constantly bang on about judeo christian superiority ?
loony lefties with a seeming obsession with genitals and change for changes sake ?
where is that solid, confident core that even creates a space for someone to want to be it, who represents it, what is that symbol.
“The West is a civilization that has survived all the prophecies of its collapse with a singular stratagem. Just as the bourgeoisie had to deny itself as a class in order to permit the bourgeoisification of society as a whole, from the worker to the baron; just as capital had to sacrifice itself as a wage relation in order to impose itself as a social relation – becoming cultural capital and health capital in addition to finance capital; just as Christianity had to sacrifice itself as a religion in order to survive as an affective structure – as a vague injunction to humility, compassion, and weakness; so the West has sacrificed itself as a particular civilization in order to impose itself as a universal culture. The operation can be summarized like this: an entity in its death throes sacrifices itself as a content in order to survive as a form.”
“There is no “clash of civilizations.” There is a clinically dead civilization kept alive by all sorts of life-support machines that spread a peculiar plague into the planet’s atmosphere. At this point it can no longer believe in a single one of its own “values,” and any affirmation of them is considered an impudent act, a provocation that should and must be taken apart, deconstructed, and returned to a state of doubt. Today Western imperialism is the imperialism of relativism, of the “it all depends on your point of view”; it is the eye-rolling or the wounded indignation at anyone who is stupid, primitive, or presumptuous enough to still believe in something, to affirm anything at all. You can see the dogmatism of constant questioning give its complicit wink of the eye everywhere in the universities and among the literary intelligentsias. No critique is too radical among postmodernist thinkers, as long as it maintains this total absence of certitude. A century ago, scandal was identified with any particularly unruly and raucous negation, while today it’s found in any affirmation that fails to tremble.
No social order can securely found itself on the principle that nothing is true. Yet it must be made secure. Applying the concept of “security” to everything these days is the expression of a project to securely fasten onto places, behaviours, and even people themselves, an ideal order to which they are no longer ready to submit. Saying “nothing is true” says nothing about the world but everything about the Western concept of truth. For the West, truth is not an attribute of beings or things, but of their representation. A representation that conforms to experience is held to be true. Science is, in the last analysis, this empire of universal verification. Since all human behaviour, from the most ordinary to the most learned, is based on a foundation of unevenly formulated presuppositions, and since all practices start from a point where things and their representations can no longer be distinguished, a dose of truth that the Western concept knows nothing about enters into every life. We talk in the West about “real people,” but only in order to mock these simpletons. This is why Westerners have always been thought of as liars and hypocrites by the people they have colonised. This is why they are envied for what they have, for their technological development, but never for what they are, for which they are rightly held in contempt. Sade, Nietzsche and Artaud wouldn’t be taught in schools if the kind of truth mentioned above was not discredited in advance. Containing all affirmations and deactivating all certainties as they irresistibly come to light-such is the long labour of the Western intellect. The police and philosophy are two convergent, if formally distinct, means to this end.”
Rugged Individualism at it's finest!
"The world is my inkblot!"
"No it's not! It's mine!"
"Well yeah. That goes without saying!"
noddy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 29, 2021 8:01 am
true enough - its probably a demographic with more voice in my country than yours - I have no idea what a conservative in America is any more.
It is really quite simple. A "Conservative" is anyone who has ever uttered the word "my" in a sentence.
For example"
... my name..
... my money....
... my house...
... my gun...
... my guitar...
... my music...
... my time...
... my job...
... my children...
In others words, anyone you meet on the street with any concept of self interest. Or..... for that matter, Self-Identity. Anyone who self-identifies as anything other than a formless ameba-like blob of photo-plasm is a Conservative or at least, a conservative.
The selfless types are rarer than Yowies in Central Park.
Last edited by Simple Minded on Tue Mar 30, 2021 11:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
Virginia parents, teachers group accused of 'racketeering,' intimidating conservative parents
"I fancied myself as some kind of god....It is a sort of disease when you consider yourself some kind of god, the creator of everything, but I feel comfortable about it now since I began to live it out.” -- George Soros
As the pandemic wanes, and I have to leave the safety of my whiteness-free castle, I know that racism is going to come roaring back into my daily life.
I’ve said, here and elsewhere, that one of the principal benefits of the pandemic is how I’ve been able to exclude racism and whiteness generally from my day-to-day life. Over the past year, I have, of course, still had to interact with white people on Zoom or watch them on television or worry about whether they would succeed in reelecting a white-supremacist president. But white people aren’t in my face all of the time. I can, more or less, only deal with whiteness when I want to. Their cops aren’t hunting me when I drive through my neighborhood; their hang-ups aren’t bothering me (or threatening me) when I’m just trying to do some shopping.
That’s because I haven’t been driving or shopping in person. White people haven’t improved; I’ve just been able to limit my exposure to them. I’ve turned my house into Wakanda: a technically advanced, globally isolated home base from which I can pick and choose when and how often to interact with white people.
WV governor approves what advocates say is the nation’s broadest nonpublic school vouchers program
In WV I have personally noted in the past that if you want to get a teacher upset start talking about school choice. One thing I will say in favor of the WV public school system is that it has the highest rate of Black Male high school graduation in the US. But in my opinion that is due to cultural factors, not the schools .
In WV most people are relatively poor. Which tends to result in people having each others backs. Certainly not everyone but a lot more than most places. IE "There, but for the grace of God go I, TODAY." It tends to keep ones feet on the ground.
"I fancied myself as some kind of god....It is a sort of disease when you consider yourself some kind of god, the creator of everything, but I feel comfortable about it now since I began to live it out.” -- George Soros
noddy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 29, 2021 8:01 am
true enough - its probably a demographic with more voice in my country than yours - I have no idea what a conservative in America is any more.
It is really quite simple. A "Conservative" is anyone who has ever uttered the word "my" in a sentence.
For example"
... my name..
... my money....
... my house...
... my gun...
... my guitar...
... my music...
... my time...
... my job...
... my children...
In others words, anyone you meet on the street with any concept of self interest. Or..... for that matter, Self-Identity. Anyone who self-identifies as anything other than a formless ameba-like blob of photo-plasm is a Conservative or at least, a conservative.
The selfless types are rarer than Yowies in Central Park.
yeh, so its not so much a belief system as a reaction to "whiteness" and wanting less of it in their lives ;P
Doc wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 9:13 pm
In WV most people are relatively poor. Which tends to result in people having each others backs. Certainly not everyone but a lot more than most places. IE "There, but for the grace of God go I, TODAY." It tends to keep ones feet on the ground.
West Virginia just can't afford to hire all these spectacular teachers.
Doc wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 9:13 pm
In WV most people are relatively poor. Which tends to result in people having each others backs. Certainly not everyone but a lot more than most places. IE "There, but for the grace of God go I, TODAY." It tends to keep ones feet on the ground.
West Virginia just can't afford to hire all these spectacular teachers.
MY father used to love to tell people "Not everyone can afford to retire in West Virginia"
"I fancied myself as some kind of god....It is a sort of disease when you consider yourself some kind of god, the creator of everything, but I feel comfortable about it now since I began to live it out.” -- George Soros
“The West is a civilization that has survived all the prophecies of its collapse with a singular stratagem. Just as the bourgeoisie had to deny itself as a class in order to permit the bourgeoisification of society as a whole, from the worker to the baron; just as capital had to sacrifice itself as a wage relation in order to impose itself as a social relation – becoming cultural capital and health capital in addition to finance capital; just as Christianity had to sacrifice itself as a religion in order to survive as an affective structure – as a vague injunction to humility, compassion, and weakness; so the West has sacrificed itself as a particular civilization in order to impose itself as a universal culture. The operation can be summarized like this: an entity in its death throes sacrifices itself as a content in order to survive as a form.”
“There is no “clash of civilizations.” There is a clinically dead civilization kept alive by all sorts of life-support machines that spread a peculiar plague into the planet’s atmosphere. At this point it can no longer believe in a single one of its own “values,” and any affirmation of them is considered an impudent act, a provocation that should and must be taken apart, deconstructed, and returned to a state of doubt. Today Western imperialism is the imperialism of relativism, of the “it all depends on your point of view”; it is the eye-rolling or the wounded indignation at anyone who is stupid, primitive, or presumptuous enough to still believe in something, to affirm anything at all. You can see the dogmatism of constant questioning give its complicit wink of the eye everywhere in the universities and among the literary intelligentsias. No critique is too radical among postmodernist thinkers, as long as it maintains this total absence of certitude. A century ago, scandal was identified with any particularly unruly and raucous negation, while today it’s found in any affirmation that fails to tremble.
No social order can securely found itself on the principle that nothing is true. Yet it must be made secure. Applying the concept of “security” to everything these days is the expression of a project to securely fasten onto places, behaviours, and even people themselves, an ideal order to which they are no longer ready to submit. Saying “nothing is true” says nothing about the world but everything about the Western concept of truth. For the West, truth is not an attribute of beings or things, but of their representation. A representation that conforms to experience is held to be true. Science is, in the last analysis, this empire of universal verification. Since all human behaviour, from the most ordinary to the most learned, is based on a foundation of unevenly formulated presuppositions, and since all practices start from a point where things and their representations can no longer be distinguished, a dose of truth that the Western concept knows nothing about enters into every life. We talk in the West about “real people,” but only in order to mock these simpletons. This is why Westerners have always been thought of as liars and hypocrites by the people they have colonised. This is why they are envied for what they have, for their technological development, but never for what they are, for which they are rightly held in contempt. Sade, Nietzsche and Artaud wouldn’t be taught in schools if the kind of truth mentioned above was not discredited in advance. Containing all affirmations and deactivating all certainties as they irresistibly come to light-such is the long labour of the Western intellect. The police and philosophy are two convergent, if formally distinct, means to this end.”
Interesting quotes. Source?
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
“The West is a civilization that has survived all the prophecies of its collapse with a singular stratagem. Just as the bourgeoisie had to deny itself as a class in order to permit the bourgeoisification of society as a whole, from the worker to the baron; just as capital had to sacrifice itself as a wage relation in order to impose itself as a social relation – becoming cultural capital and health capital in addition to finance capital; just as Christianity had to sacrifice itself as a religion in order to survive as an affective structure – as a vague injunction to humility, compassion, and weakness; so the West has sacrificed itself as a particular civilization in order to impose itself as a universal culture. The operation can be summarized like this: an entity in its death throes sacrifices itself as a content in order to survive as a form.”
“There is no “clash of civilizations.” There is a clinically dead civilization kept alive by all sorts of life-support machines that spread a peculiar plague into the planet’s atmosphere. At this point it can no longer believe in a single one of its own “values,” and any affirmation of them is considered an impudent act, a provocation that should and must be taken apart, deconstructed, and returned to a state of doubt. Today Western imperialism is the imperialism of relativism, of the “it all depends on your point of view”; it is the eye-rolling or the wounded indignation at anyone who is stupid, primitive, or presumptuous enough to still believe in something, to affirm anything at all. You can see the dogmatism of constant questioning give its complicit wink of the eye everywhere in the universities and among the literary intelligentsias. No critique is too radical among postmodernist thinkers, as long as it maintains this total absence of certitude. A century ago, scandal was identified with any particularly unruly and raucous negation, while today it’s found in any affirmation that fails to tremble.
No social order can securely found itself on the principle that nothing is true. Yet it must be made secure. Applying the concept of “security” to everything these days is the expression of a project to securely fasten onto places, behaviours, and even people themselves, an ideal order to which they are no longer ready to submit. Saying “nothing is true” says nothing about the world but everything about the Western concept of truth. For the West, truth is not an attribute of beings or things, but of their representation. A representation that conforms to experience is held to be true. Science is, in the last analysis, this empire of universal verification. Since all human behaviour, from the most ordinary to the most learned, is based on a foundation of unevenly formulated presuppositions, and since all practices start from a point where things and their representations can no longer be distinguished, a dose of truth that the Western concept knows nothing about enters into every life. We talk in the West about “real people,” but only in order to mock these simpletons. This is why Westerners have always been thought of as liars and hypocrites by the people they have colonised. This is why they are envied for what they have, for their technological development, but never for what they are, for which they are rightly held in contempt. Sade, Nietzsche and Artaud wouldn’t be taught in schools if the kind of truth mentioned above was not discredited in advance. Containing all affirmations and deactivating all certainties as they irresistibly come to light-such is the long labour of the Western intellect. The police and philosophy are two convergent, if formally distinct, means to this end.”
Interesting quotes. Source?
The Coming Insurrection by the Invisible Committee (the French hard left)
but it could've easily been a description written by a medievalist schoolman. (maybe demonstrated by that first things article miss fishtits has posted)
Good stuff. It begs the question: "All this woke/racist stuff sounds so stupid on it's face, how could anyone ever possibly buy into it?"
There's a lot of money in grevience studies and race-baiting I guess.
rEZLlOWPp4g
There is lots of power in it.
Imagine the horrors of a world without the democrat party.
DjnBF82UwAAKI65.jpg (60.43 KiB) Viewed 1862 times
Imagine a world where you can walk down the street and everyone fears you
And a mob shall lead the the way
C8B_HadW0AA3Ynn.jpg (133.93 KiB) Viewed 1862 times
"I fancied myself as some kind of god....It is a sort of disease when you consider yourself some kind of god, the creator of everything, but I feel comfortable about it now since I began to live it out.” -- George Soros
